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Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

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Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#41

Post by hattmall »

jghn wrote: post #25
xscott wrote: post #6

The other one I'm seeing lately is a semi-stealth "service charge" on the bill. Something like 18% to 20% added to the bill without really standing out. This used to be something they'd do for "larger parties", but now I'm seeing it even when I'm eating solo. This makes for an uncomfortable situation where I now have to ask the waiter or bartender if they receive this as a tip. Then I need to decide if I want to tip…

When this started showing up near me the places that did it trained their staff to tell you up front that it was on there. They'd make a comment that you can add extra if you wish, but no obligation to do so. Over time I've found more and more they just don't mention it at all. More than once I got home and realized I tipped on top of the total + service charge: "Why was that about $100 more than I thought it'd be?",…

Geeze, $100 more? So like your $400 dinner was $500 instead?

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#42

Post by Buttons840 »

add-sub-mul-div wrote: post #11
xscott wrote: post #6

The other one I'm seeing lately is a semi-stealth "service charge" on the bill. Something like 18% to 20% added to the bill without really standing out. This used to be something they'd do for "larger parties", but now I'm seeing it even when I'm eating solo. This makes for an uncomfortable situation where I now have to ask the waiter or bartender if they receive this as a tip. Then I need to decide if I want to tip…

Six months ago I was at a burrito place and saw as I was paying that there was a new 3% fee for paying with a credit card. I have not gone back there since. Asking $11 for a burrito was already iffy and by then I'd started to curtail fast food purchases. I can't even imagine paying an 18-20% fee that isn't meant to be the entirety of the tip.

The Visa terms of service forbid charging extra for payments using a Visa. Other credit cards have similar terms I think.

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#43

Post by cute_boi »

TheDong wrote: post #17
add-sub-mul-div wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Six months ago I was at a burrito place and saw as I was paying that there was a new 3% fee for paying with a credit card. I have not gone back there since. Asking $11 for a burrito was already iffy and by then I'd started to curtail fast food purchases. I can't even imagine paying an 18-20% fee that isn't meant to be the entirety of the tip.

A 3% fee for a card makes perfect sense to me. That's not far off from what the merchant is losing for credit card customers, so their options are: 1. Charge the same for credit cards as cash, and make cash paying customers effectively pay more, thus applying a regressive tax to the poor (who are less likely to have credit cards) 2. Charge more for the credit card paying customers, and they can avoid this extra payme…

I think this will be solved once Credit Card Competition Act is approved.

Cash isn't a solution.

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#44

Post by nicbou »

These kinds of behaviour change the entire relationship between you and a business from transactional to adversarial. You're no longer engaging in a clear transaction, but in a negotiation that involves guilt tripping and fear of judgement. I just want a beer; why do I have to defend how much my interaction is worth on top of the retail price?

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#45

Post by uptown »

Went bowling yesterday. A tip prompt turned up when it was time to pay with no obvious way to avoid tipping. To do so you just had to hit enter instead of picking one of the preset choices but I couldn’t fathom why I’d ever tip the guy who hands me my one shoe back after knocking down some pins.

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#46

Post by dataflow »

btilly wrote: post #8

The worst service that I ever received was in France, where tips were mandatory and could not be varied. I've never been so offended at being asked to tip as when it was done by the smug jerk who had just arranged to make sure that I didn't enjoy my meal, and who knew that they would get their full cut of my unhappy experience. I have no problem tipping in the moment. And sometimes for very different amounts than exp…

Do you have more than 1 data point here?

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#47

Post by britzkopf »

In Canada, there is no longer any special wage below the minimum for servers. They receive the same minimum as many other blue collar workers. It's over, there is no longer any reasonable argument for tipping servers but not a whole host of other low wage earners.

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#48

Post by cute_boi »

rootusrootus wrote: post #32
TheDong wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A 3% fee for a card makes perfect sense to me. That's not far off from what the merchant is losing for credit card customers, so their options are: 1. Charge the same for credit cards as cash, and make cash paying customers effectively pay more, thus applying a regressive tax to the poor (who are less likely to have credit cards) 2. Charge more for the credit card paying customers, and they can avoid this extra payme…

If you charge 3% just to credit card users, they are now subsidizing the cash customers. I am guessing you are assuming the cost of cash handling to be zero.

well they must take cash anyway, so cost of handling cash isn't that significant compared to fixed+variable cost of credit card.

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#49

Post by dataflow »

speakfreely wrote: post #10

Customers actually do have a way to retaliate against establishments they feel are abusive: leave a bad review. Businesses depend on the organic traffic they get from Google and Yelp listings, so sustained feedback against abusive tipping pressure will get noticed if people start to make a point to write reviews about it.

> Customers actually do have a way to retaliate against establishments they feel are abusive: leave a bad review.

What do you do if you don't want that review tied to your account/identity, or prefer the fact that you've gone to that establishment to not be published to the whole world?

Re: Tip pressure might work in the moment, but customers are less likely to return

#50

Post by rootusrootus »

jaco6 wrote: post #19

I work at a Dominos and we of course accept and expect tips on delivery, because without tips the drivers would make But at checkout for carryout orders the card terminal also now opens a tip menu. I would never tip on this screen because the employees are already paid a true hourly wage, albeit a low one, not a server rate that is below minimum wage. Furthermore there is no way for the customer to know if the employ…

> I work at a Dominos and we of course accept and expect tips on delivery, because without tips the drivers would make The business should own the cars and pay for the fuel. Or they need to be at least compensating drivers by the mile at the current IRS rate. Especially considering Dominos charges a delivery fee. Where is that going to if not to the drivers?
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