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MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

mullvad.net

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Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#41

Post by latexr »

mgoetzke wrote: post #37
latexr wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s an unfair characterisation. It’s just restoring windows, some of which happen to be browser windows, which then load a website with auto-playing video or audio that (unsurprisingly) starts playing. No one is selling it as a feature to “play sound when waking up from sleep”. I bet that if you configured the browser to never auto-play, this wouldn’t happen. To clarify, because commenters seem to be misunderstand…

To clarify it restores windows AFTER a reboot, BEFORE i login. What RIGHT does it have to create processes with a user BEFORE I authenticate to the machine ?

Yes, I understand, I have encountered that as well and I agree it shouldn’t happen.

My only quarrel is with the other user implying Apple is selling this as a feature. I have my fair share of criticism of Apple and other tech companies, but let’s please not let blind hate take over and dilute arguments.

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#42

Post by radicality »

mgoetzke wrote: post #2

it also leaks the audio of tabs before logging in. Even though I had disabled all 'restore' applications features, macos sometimes decides to 'start' browsers BEFORE logging in after a restart AND those start auto-playing audio from whatever was paused before the reboot (or many days before). Since then I went rather deep disabling that feature, but I never trusted it.

Damn, how is that possible? I imagine you have FileVault enabled, and if so this sounds like some security bypass?

I was under the impression that until you provide the password after a reboot, the system should know nothing about you as all user data should be encrypted, so it should not know what apps you had open before reboot let alone start playing sound.

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#43

Post by latexr »

eptcyka wrote: post #20
latexr wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s an unfair characterisation. It’s just restoring windows, some of which happen to be browser windows, which then load a website with auto-playing video or audio that (unsurprisingly) starts playing. No one is selling it as a feature to “play sound when waking up from sleep”. I bet that if you configured the browser to never auto-play, this wouldn’t happen. To clarify, because commenters seem to be misunderstand…

Does it matter if the end result is that the browser plays audio before you've authenticated your user session?

The characterisation matters, yes. Because when you ascribe wrong motivations out of perceived spite, it makes it less likely the people who can fix it want to do so.

I’m not defending the bug, I’m replying to the post below it.

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#44

Post by latexr »

dspillett wrote: post #39
latexr wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s an unfair characterisation. It’s just restoring windows, some of which happen to be browser windows, which then load a website with auto-playing video or audio that (unsurprisingly) starts playing. No one is selling it as a feature to “play sound when waking up from sleep”. I bet that if you configured the browser to never auto-play, this wouldn’t happen. To clarify, because commenters seem to be misunderstand…

No one is selling it as a feature, no, but I would still consider it an OS level bug, and a security one at that. Focusing on the browser is a step away from the point: if I'm not signed in, I don't want sound playing from any app⁰. I've had Windows do something similar, a media player deciding to unpause when coming up from hibernate (this was before Windows seemingly broke hibernate) and for some reason being at fu…

> No one is selling it as a feature, no

That’s all I’m saying.

> but I would still consider it an OS level bug

I agree.

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#45

Post by gtvwill »

sureIy wrote: post #29
gtvwill wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linux on desktop has been ready for years now, it absolutely shreds apple and microsofts offerings, ubuntu desktop is about as schmick as it gets regardless of your views of the parent company. Mac on the other hand is an absolute nightmare to administer for clients. Same with their phones. Printing from web browser on a Mac? Completely broken. Have to save everything to desktop and open it from there. It's an absolu…

Can I ctrl-paste the contents of my phone's clipboard onto my Linux computer? How many hours would that take to set up? Because that works out of the box with Macs and iPhones. Pretty useful daily.

Yeah that's been easy for a few years now. Kdeconnect works great/it's been available on Linux since well before windows got it.

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#46

Post by slicedbrandy »

lionkor wrote: post #38
sureIy wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I ctrl-paste the contents of my phone's clipboard onto my Linux computer? How many hours would that take to set up? Because that works out of the box with Macs and iPhones. Pretty useful daily.

Kde connect works fine most of the time to share clipboard, send files, etc

I had a look into KDE connect out of interest, but found it to be quite lacking in functionality for iOS. The limitations likely stem from Apple's locked down approach to their OS and security, but the limitations remain.

https://userbase.kde.org/KDEConnect#Missing_or_limited_featu...

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#47

Post by f1shy »

mgoetzke wrote: post #2

it also leaks the audio of tabs before logging in. Even though I had disabled all 'restore' applications features, macos sometimes decides to 'start' browsers BEFORE logging in after a restart AND those start auto-playing audio from whatever was paused before the reboot (or many days before). Since then I went rather deep disabling that feature, but I never trusted it.

Somewhat loosely related, but I have something similar with the iPhone browser. Where opening the browser will shortly show the last page I had open (even I carefully closed it before closing the browser). Even if it never got me into trouble, I found that annoying as s. And could potentially make problems.

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#48

Post by f1shy »

threeseed wrote: post #9
mgoetzke wrote: post #2

it also leaks the audio of tabs before logging in. Even though I had disabled all 'restore' applications features, macos sometimes decides to 'start' browsers BEFORE logging in after a restart AND those start auto-playing audio from whatever was paused before the reboot (or many days before). Since then I went rather deep disabling that feature, but I never trusted it.

I have never heard of anyone with this issue. The only explanation is that you restarted whilst having the "Open All Previous Application" checkbox enabled. And yes it will launch processes after you have logged in but before the Desktop is shown. Either that you or you have some launch daemon that is opening a browser.

I had this issue, and something similar in my old iPhone. I'm sure there are other explanations, because yours is not it.

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#49

Post by AstralStorm »

Jerrrrrrry wrote: post #26
chx wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not think the user particularly cares whether it was an intentional feature or an unfortunate byproduct of features and bugs when they open a laptop in a classroom or a meeting and it starts blaring the music they listened to before closing it.

Some areas of expertise require so much work, it nearly prevents the student from learning to appreciate the intent, the craft, itself. It's like being literally unable to dog Opening a laptop, even if the last activity was blaring obnoxious carnival music, should _allow_, not _demand_ the user to resume their last function - which was explicitly to _pause_ the laptop, by closing the lid. If I close the lid, I am don…

You're asking the OSes to actually implement proper session management and centralized leak controls?

It has never happened before...

Re: MacOS sometimes leaks traffic after system updates

#50

Post by f1shy »

bayindirh wrote: post #14
pt_PT_guy wrote: post #6

[flagged]

Mhmm... A POSIX compliant OS which is bundled with a calibrated high gamut screen, low latency audio stack, and relatively high speed networking with good thread scheduling, great memory management and tremendous uptime numbers for a personal computer. ...a toy OS which becomes invisible most of the time for serious users indeed. I prefer Linux over anything else, but let's be real.

Excellent reply. I hate windows viscerally, but I would also not call it toy. Neither Linux, FreeBSD, Windows (and many others) are toys. Linux, BTW, started as a toy, but is far from it now.
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