Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

theverge.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 607 posts

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#41

Post by lovethevoid »

tmtvl wrote: post #6

Wait, so the Google Play Store, which you can install alternatives to (F-Droid, Aurora, Amazon,...), and where you can easily install apps through other means (such as downloading an APK through your browser and running it from the file manager) is an illegal monopoly while the Apple App Store isn't? Well, I guess Google's market cap is only 2 trillion compared to Apple's 3 trillion, so I guess that's fair.

Android has far more users both globally and in the US specifically, and the Play Store has triple the amount of downloads that the App Store has. This gives it far less lenience than Apple got in the EU, where it isn't even as dominant as in the US. Apple also has the benefit of being a sole operator of its platform, whereas Android and the Play Store aren't Google-only.

Also Amazon was a key reason why the ruling indicates the other stores must have access to play store apps as well.

Additionally, Google royally messed up this entire case from the start by being so openly egregious. Amateur hour sending emails about buying a company to shut them up from suing you.

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#42

Post by Timshel »

tmtvl wrote: post #6

Wait, so the Google Play Store, which you can install alternatives to (F-Droid, Aurora, Amazon,...), and where you can easily install apps through other means (such as downloading an APK through your browser and running it from the file manager) is an illegal monopoly while the Apple App Store isn't? Well, I guess Google's market cap is only 2 trillion compared to Apple's 3 trillion, so I guess that's fair.

It's not just allowing alternative stores, it's stuff like:

- Stop requiring Google Play Billing for apps distributed on the Google Play Store (the jury found that Google had illegally tied its payment system to its app store)

- Let Android developers tell users about other ways to pay from within the Play Store

- Let Android developers link to ways to download their apps outside of the Play Store

- Let Android developers set their own prices for apps irrespective of Play Billing

Removing those restriction on billing in the app will probably have way more impact in the end.

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#43

Post by talldayo »

tencentshill wrote: post #21

Soon we'll have the Verizon Appstore and the Spotify Appstore and the Zoom Appstore, the exclusive home for each app and their partners, each with it's own overlapping user tracking libraries and insecure payment methods, and no one can even tell them to do otherwise. Coming soon to iOS, too!

That can only happen if Apple's first-party distribution terms aren't attractive. If the App Store is capable of standing on it's own, then third parties shouldn't pose a threat to it. Something tells me the lower prices and free software on alternative stores will drive adoption though.

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#44

Post by akira2501 »

tmtvl wrote: post #6

Wait, so the Google Play Store, which you can install alternatives to (F-Droid, Aurora, Amazon,...), and where you can easily install apps through other means (such as downloading an APK through your browser and running it from the file manager) is an illegal monopoly while the Apple App Store isn't? Well, I guess Google's market cap is only 2 trillion compared to Apple's 3 trillion, so I guess that's fair.

> is an illegal monopoly while the Apple App Store isn't?

This lawsuit is focused on Google. It's existence or the facts conveyed within do not provide any cover to Apple. They don't prevent Apple from facing the same lawsuit or from being covered by the same judgement.

Do you feel this way when we put a murderer away? I mean, "his murder was illegal, but yet, some people still get away with it?! What is this injustice?!"

> so I guess that's fair.

Would you prefer court cases to involve several dozen defendants at once? Would that be more "fair?"

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#45

Post by 2OEH8eoCRo0 »

tencentshill wrote: post #21

Soon we'll have the Verizon Appstore and the Spotify Appstore and the Zoom Appstore, the exclusive home for each app and their partners, each with it's own overlapping user tracking libraries and insecure payment methods, and no one can even tell them to do otherwise. Coming soon to iOS, too!

I like my app store called "the internet."

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#46

Post by gjsman-1000 »

jncfhnb wrote: post #40
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Apple's claim is simple: The monopoly was from the very beginning, when the iPhone had 0.0% market share. If it was anti-competitive, the iPhone would have failed. If developers didn't like it, the iPhone would have failed. Has Apple unfairly done anything new now that they have a monopoly? No. Did Apple raise their 30% royalty to 70% when they had a monopoly? No. The problem is not a monopoly on hardware. The prob…

> The problem is gatekeeping access to software markets

However, it started out this way, from the beginning, and developers accepted it. This is easily demonstrable - customers would not have bought devices without apps, and vice versa. Very hard to show, in a court of law, that the terms which were once acceptable now magically aren't.

The law isn't interested in people who say, "yes, it was a perfectly fine contract, 10 years ago, but now it's a problem even though it hasn't changed." Imagine what would happen to mortgages.

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#48

Post by akira2501 »

tencentshill wrote: post #21

Soon we'll have the Verizon Appstore and the Spotify Appstore and the Zoom Appstore, the exclusive home for each app and their partners, each with it's own overlapping user tracking libraries and insecure payment methods, and no one can even tell them to do otherwise. Coming soon to iOS, too!

Yep. Then consumers can decide which one is best for them. Then they can compete. Then the best features with the best pricing, no only for customers, but the cut for developers, can be discovered.

You pay such a high price for living in the walled garden. I honestly can't imagine why you would _want_ it.

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#49

Post by frizlab »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #18
xnx wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is ridiculous. From Google's reply ( https://blog.google/outreach-initiatives/public-policy/epic-... ): "These Epic-requested changes stem from a decision that is completely contrary to another court’s rejection of similar claims Epic made against Apple — even though, unlike iOS, Android is an open platform that has always allowed for choice and flexibility like multiple app stores and sideloading."

[flagged]

THIS. And this is the main reason why I hate the EU decisions. Apple was always 100% clear on their message. The App Store is a closed ecosystem. You hate it? You don’t have to use it. You can do PWAs.

If they attacked Apple on their PWA support, I’d have backed the case (though nobody cares, obviously). But the case as it is now is dumb.

Re: Google must open Android for third-party stores, rules Epic judge

#50

Post by atrus »

whimsicalism wrote: post #30
ToucanLoucan wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, the review part I support. The revenue part is fucking horseshit.

I think it should all be circumventable. My phone, like my computer, should be able to install whatever code I damn well please.

> My phone

Maybe that's the assumption you need to change

Post reply on HN