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Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

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Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#41

Post by floatrock »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #13
EligibleDecoy wrote: post #8

The hypocrisy is that if safety was the overall concern, then motorcycles would have been banned a long time ago (and I say this as someone who enjoys riding my motorcycle). I think the actual problem is that when compared to other cars in their category these kei trucks do have abysmal safety standards such as no airbags or crumple zones. Which is because there isn’t a mini truck category in the US. Basically all pi…

> if safety was the overall concern, then motorcycles would have been banned a long time ago And horse riding on the road - it’s still legal. I believe you can even ride cows in most countries Safety of the driver , mind you, should be lower priority than safety of others, I.e. pedestrians. Driver chose to drive whatever that is, but pedestrians didn’t. From that perspective motorcycles are great, they are least like…

> And horse riding on the road - it’s still legal.

I take it you've never lived around Amish or Mennonite communities?

(Although to be fair, they have been required to put reflectors and sometimes turn signals on their buggies...)

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#42

Post by capitainenemo »

ejstronge wrote: post #30
tourmalinetaco wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A small truck has just as much possibility to kill as a big truck, and in fact due to the smaller application of similar forces its more likely to seriously cripple you, even if said hit was non-fatal. While I’m all for reducing the size of cars in USA, pretending that ”massive modern trucks” are the only ones that kill is just wrong.

> A small truck has just as much possibility to kill as a big truck, and in fact due to the smaller application of similar forces its more likely to seriously cripple you, even if said hit was non-fatal. > While I’m all for reducing the size of cars in USA, pretending that ”massive modern trucks” are the only ones that kill is just wrong. The argument is that a larger truck is more likely to kill - instead of resulti…

Yes, and it's not just mass, it's also hood height. https://ssti.us/2024/01/29/vehicle-hoods-are-now-four-inches...

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#43

Post by sundaeofshock »

tourmalinetaco wrote: post #23
spdgg wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it funny that the safety standards are for the drivers, not everyone around them. Small trucks = not safe Massive modern trucks killing cyclists and pedestrians = very safe! (For the driver)

A small truck has just as much possibility to kill as a big truck, and in fact due to the smaller application of similar forces its more likely to seriously cripple you, even if said hit was non-fatal. While I’m all for reducing the size of cars in USA, pretending that ”massive modern trucks” are the only ones that kill is just wrong.

“Large SUVs and pickup trucks are, unsurprisingly, more likely than smaller cars to injure or kill pedestrians due to their greater weight and taller front ends.”

https://towardsdatascience.com/suvs-are-killing-people-de6ce....

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#44

Post by cuddlyogre »

short_sells_poo wrote: post #27
loloquwowndueo wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Motorbikes are hobby vehicles.

Not in a city they aren't. They are an excellent commuting tool that offers much of the flexibility of a car for a fraction of the cost and much better commute time.

And several times the noise and pollution.

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#45

Post by _yb2s »

themaninthedark wrote: post #2

Given the reasoning for refusal is that the vehicles don't meet safety standards, I wonder if they will stop registering older American vehicles as well for lack of safety standards but also for emissions?

It makes sense to regulate what can be sold new, while grandfathering in what was sold legally in the past. People won’t stand for the government jerking people around and saying “this vehicle you purchased legally is now illegal and can’t be driven or sold, and you need to buy another with your own money… but no guarantees we won’t immediately ban the new one also.” Cars have a finite life span unless restored at great expense, so the problem takes care of itself without overbearing laws that would be seen as the government stealing peoples personal property. Appreciating classic cars is also a mainstay of American culture- with most towns having classic car shows, and things like discounted registration and insurance for antique cars.

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#46

Post by gedy »

PetitPrince wrote: post #26
khafra wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compacts, subcompacts, and microcompacts are very popular in Europe. Is this because Europe has fewer and less restrictive standards for fuel economy, emissions, and safety? I am not an automotive policy expert, but I feel like Europe tends to regulate more than the US does.

One factor to take into account is that streets and roads are narrower (or at least feels narrower). I would be very uncomfortable driving those huge SUV where I live.

Yeah my expat friend owns a midsized (for the US) SUV in Spain, and she finds it incredibly difficult to use in the city she lives in due to the narrow streets + sidewalk cafes.

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#47

Post by rjzzleep »

Amezarak wrote: post #22
EligibleDecoy wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because of a quirk of emissions controls in the US. Longer wheelbases and heavier vehicles can get by with poorer emissions. It was done, at the time, to help semi trailers and other huge trucks meet less restrictive requirements without specifically calling them out but now has led to each manufacturer making vehicles as large as possible so meeting emissions restrictions is more economical.

This gets brought up on HN every time the subject comes up but it doesn't make sense. It is true that, sensibly, emissions regulations are more relaxed as vehicles get larger. But smaller vehicles are still cheaper to make and sell for lower MSRPs than the same manufacturer's larger cars, and larger cars almost always hugely outsell them. Sadly, this has meant that a lot of small cars, like the Honda Fit, have been d…

> HN users are not representative. Kei car enthusiasts are not representative. Americans love F-150s, Tacomas, Highlanders, 4runners, RAV4s, CRVs, etc. They by-and-large buy the largest car/truck they can afford. You look up the sales numbers for this stuff and there's just no contest; e.g., CRVs outsold Fits by almost a factor of 10.

This is true, but even outside the US in a lot of Asian places with no apparent space for big cars everything is getting bigger, why is that?

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#48

Post by themaninthedark »

_yb2s wrote: post #45
themaninthedark wrote: post #2

Given the reasoning for refusal is that the vehicles don't meet safety standards, I wonder if they will stop registering older American vehicles as well for lack of safety standards but also for emissions?

It makes sense to regulate what can be sold new, while grandfathering in what was sold legally in the past. People won’t stand for the government jerking people around and saying “this vehicle you purchased legally is now illegal and can’t be driven or sold, and you need to buy another with your own money… but no guarantees we won’t immediately ban the new one also.” Cars have a finite life span unless restored at gr…

From the way I read the article, it appears to me that the vehicle registration must be renewed:

>But Massachusetts is now pointing out that kei trucks and vans don’t meet federal safety standards and recently included them on a list of vehicles that can’t be registered in the state. The state is now reconsidering that decision, leaving kei truck owners wondering whether they’ll be able to keep driving these vehicles.

>All existing unexpired registrations for Kei trucks and vans will remain active as the RMV works to review and assess industry standards related to Kei mini trucks and develop an updated policy addressing the registration of these vehicles. From: https://www.mass.gov/info-details/vehicles-that-cannot-be-re....

So depending on how registrations in MA work and if they expire, they will be pulling the rug out from under the owners.

Related, if we are worried about crash safety(ostentatiously of the operator and passengers) why does MA still allow motorcycles?

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#49

Post by filmor »

tsuru wrote: post #33

Japan has different standards and driving environment around kei cars (I'm going to use K-car going forward). - Their top speed limit even on highways is 100kmh / 60mph - K-cars have yellow license plates and yellow license plates are not allowed on highways I have a memory of seeing one of the infamous white K-trucks on an interstate in Nashville and was gobsmacked. These cars are not rated for highway / interstates…

Where does it say that K-cars are not allowed on highways? I'm certain that I saw quite a few, and I can find no source that says otherwise.

Re: Mini imported Japanese vehicles may soon be banned on Massachusetts roads

#50

Post by adolph »

reedf1 wrote: post #7

Many Japanese vehicles are banned, especially light trucks, because they are too competitive. They are often banned for trumped up reasons, mostly to protect local competition.

While true, at issue in TFA is importing older vehicles. A motor vehicle that is at least 25 years old can be lawfully imported into the U.S. without regard to whether it complies with all applicable [Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards (FMVSS)]. [0]

As noted in TheDrive.com [1] a few weeks ago, the lobby/professional group for various state DMVs, American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators, has decided for some reason to promote DMVs outlawing by regulation small vehicles. The kei car enthusiast community is directly threatened by this and the Japanese Domestic Market (JDM) enthusiast community sees this effort as a shot across the bow. Thus they are working the PR channels to get legislative help in rolling back the regulatory rulemaking.

0. https://www.nhtsa.gov/importing-vehicle/importation-and-cert...

1. https://www.thedrive.com/news/massachusetts-reviewing-kei-ca...

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