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Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

theguardian.com

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Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#41

Post by Loughla »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #20
fermentation wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The areas where these would be used are super crowded, it is likely that the riders are constantly bumping into people.

I see. Why not just limit the speed to that of a fast walking / slow running human and/or fine those who would ride carelessly enough to bump so people would have to remember deciding to ride means taking responsibility? Maybe also ban using smartphone while riding.

>people would have to remember deciding to ride means taking responsibility

And that, dear reader, is where the plan falls apart entirely.

But for real, regulation exists because large groups of people generally can't be expected to act rationally.

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#42

Post by mikepurvis »

bilsbie wrote: post #38
behringer wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, except for the people they inevitably run into and/or injure. Sometimes it is better to restrict these things especially in public places.

How does it work for bicycles?

You don’t ride your bicycle through an airport terminal?

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#43

Post by Loughla »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #34

I can’t help but think Japan’s recent anti tourist mania is going to hurt them significantly. The country already has a reputation for xenophobia and discrimination, and the visibility of social media and news media attacks against tourists over trivial things like this is just going to keep young people from going there. And their economy needs them.

Does their existing xenophobia and well known exclusionary society stop tourism now? My experience is that only makes people more interested in going to Japan. Is like a cool kid's club.

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#44

Post by mrfuuton »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #34

I can’t help but think Japan’s recent anti tourist mania is going to hurt them significantly. The country already has a reputation for xenophobia and discrimination, and the visibility of social media and news media attacks against tourists over trivial things like this is just going to keep young people from going there. And their economy needs them.

Wouldn't call this a trivial thing.

It does have a principled argument to make, in which locals would ask if it's fair for owners of this kind of luggage to continue without a license in a place where electric scooters and mopeds are common, and require a license to use.

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#45

Post by Loughla »

piafraus wrote: post #37
petsfed wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of the problem here is that it seems like you can't actually pedal this thing, which is to me (and a lot of lawmakers in the US) sort of foundational to the concept "bicycle". The other problem here is that with ever-increasing electric motor technology, old standards like engine displacement, or even power supply (gas vs electric) are not great indicators of the maximum speed of these things. As it stands, whil…

> you can't actually pedal this thing... sort of foundational to the concept "bicycle". Interesting. Just wondering - what does "pedal" mean to you. Explicitly spinning and explicitly with feets? Are any of those not considered bicycles to you? -Elliptical bicycle -Treadmill bicycle -Handcycle

The first two don't go anywhere and therefore aren't a problem. The third is just a variation of bicycle. What is your point here?

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#46

Post by ehnto »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #15

Why? Is there supposed to be any problem in riding suitcases besides the very fact this formally breaks a law? Shouldn't they better just update the law to add an exception?

Those rules are about delineation between scooters and bicycles. The easiest way to think about it is this: Bicycles have performance limitations for safety and licensing reasons, pedal assist with a speed limit has proven a convenient performance measure for a bicycle in a bunch of countries.

Scooters have no such performance restrictions and as such require licensing, age limits, insurance and all that jazz.

So TL;DR it's just a convenient demarcation between two classes of vehicle performance, that doesn't also limit human only powered bicycles or full scooters.

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#47

Post by zamadatix »

piafraus wrote: post #37
petsfed wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of the problem here is that it seems like you can't actually pedal this thing, which is to me (and a lot of lawmakers in the US) sort of foundational to the concept "bicycle". The other problem here is that with ever-increasing electric motor technology, old standards like engine displacement, or even power supply (gas vs electric) are not great indicators of the maximum speed of these things. As it stands, whil…

> you can't actually pedal this thing... sort of foundational to the concept "bicycle". Interesting. Just wondering - what does "pedal" mean to you. Explicitly spinning and explicitly with feets? Are any of those not considered bicycles to you? -Elliptical bicycle -Treadmill bicycle -Handcycle

Whether a "treadmill bicycle" counts seems on the level as asking "if the impossible burger is a burger" or "if a hotdog is a sandwich" in terms of failure to gain any clarity by asking.

On the literal sense every dictionary definition of "bicycle" is going to include some variation of "pedal driven". In the practical sense whatever functions enough like a bicycle is going to count, typically alluded to by being called a ${thing} bicycle, but "it moves on wheels and you go on it" isn't going to clear that bar on its own in this "electric suitcase".

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#48

Post by sandworm101 »

mikepurvis wrote: post #42
bilsbie wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does it work for bicycles?

You don’t ride your bicycle through an airport terminal?

Why not? If it can be folded into a carry-on, draw a line between bicycle and wheelchair. I doubt many would object to a carry that turns into an electric wheelchair.

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#49

Post by ehnto »

nomel wrote: post #39
irjustin wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Shouldn't they better just update the law to add an exception? No, the point is in crowded places like airports you don't want people zipping around on electric scooters, suitcases or otherwise, running into people - esp elderly.

So, a speed limit rather than a complete ban?

No one wants you zipping around them on a suitcase in general, I dont think a speed limit helps (also enforcement). A complete ban makes sense for the same reason you can't ride your bicycle or scooter in the airport.

Re: Japan cracks down on use of rideable electric suitcases amid tourist boom

#50

Post by irjustin »

nomel wrote: post #39
irjustin wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Shouldn't they better just update the law to add an exception? No, the point is in crowded places like airports you don't want people zipping around on electric scooters, suitcases or otherwise, running into people - esp elderly.

So, a speed limit rather than a complete ban?

Enforcement is not worth the benefit of allowing luggage scooters.

You've got to have "police" everywhere who need to be trained to identify when someone is going too fast. Who does enforcement? Actual police? You need a lot more police than normal. Airport staff? They're not enforcers. They keep the carts in the right location and bathrooms tidy. But, let's say you can have enforcers. So enforcer says slow down, kid says okayyyyyyy and then goes fast again right out of eye sight. But speed limits on the luggage! No way, so add an on/off button to comply because no one wants to buy only a slow luggage, but you've still got that person who "won't airplane mode".

Repeat offenders? Now you've just confiscated their luggage. That's gonna be good.

In this scenario, electric luggage == actual scooter. You don't ride actual scooters through an airport, but I've seen so many electric luggage scooters.

I admit they're cool af and everytime I see someone on one I'm jelly. They're their own advertising. But they're at an airpot and it's crowded for the speed. I'm already stressed enough - I don't need your kid running into me at speed.

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