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Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

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Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#41

Post by OutOfHere »

cqqxo4zV46cp wrote: post #37
WheatMillington wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a big old "citation needed". As far as I'm aware that's a crackpot conspiracy theory - just because some fringe lunatic alleges something is enough to honestly decribe that something as "alleged".

Didn’t you hear? Since Hacker News hates Boeing now, all reasoning goes out the window as long as it’s in service of looking smart by dog-piling on the company that the other totally smart HN users also hate.

Think about it this way. If you mentally torture an employee for 30+ years, and lead them to suicide, how are you not culpable?

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#42

Post by ethbr1 »

tim333 wrote: post #39
craftkiller wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree its unlikely, but none of that makes murder less likely / more difficult. Two easy ways to do that: either shoot him and then lock him in the car, or coerce him into suicide via blackmail (threaten to kill his family, threaten to plant child pornography on his property)

The first one isn't easy - drag the body to the car in daylight in the hotel car park? How are you going to lock it with the fob inside? If I was a hitman I'd do something else. The second - if you assume it's on behalf of Boeing could easily backfire if he went to the press with the threats.

Also, if the litmus for corporate murder is "possible", then that includes essentially any death.

90 year old expiring from cancer? That's what they want you to think!

In fact, we'll never know. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence... or at least, some.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but neither is it proof.

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#43

Post by ethbr1 »

WhackyIdeas wrote: post #33
OutOfHere wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not a fringe theory. It is quite mainstream. Boeing is ostensibly "protected from above" due to their military and space contracts, but as we're seeing with Starliner, such contracts are proving to be a liability.

As I only just recently found out about Boeing’s involvement in making missiles which Israel uses in Gaza, it would unfortunately not surprise me if these particular conspiracy hypothesis are more than just hypothesis. At least for Boeing, they’ll be benefiting from the fear other potential whistleblowers may have. But it’s also possible that Boeing don’t know about the deaths because someone else has done it for the…

Didn't, but some reasons why?

(a) You're starting from just finding out Boeing is a major defense contractor.

(b) Everything after that is your opinions on conspiracy theories, without any content.

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#44

Post by hedora »

xeornet wrote: post #27
hedora wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 777 has killed one and injured 104 passengers this year, and the 787 has injured 50. Are you and the parent comment missing a /s? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore_Airlines_Flight_32... https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/12/australia/latam-airlines-flig...

Both of those incidents have a total of zero percent relation to the aircraft being Boeing or its design. The CNN article is wrong, it was since found the seat move switch was pushed and interfered with flight controls. The 777 was severe turbulence. The death was a heart attack. Lol…

Regarding the turbulence, from Wikipedia:

> The autopilot, being engaged, pitched the plane downwards to return to 37,000 feet (11,278 m).

That was the strong negative G maneuver that broke the ceiling by crashing people into it. There was a second strong acceleration when it returned to the desired altitude. My reading of this is that most of the injuries were due to the autopilot’s reaction to the turbulence. Otherwise, it just would have been an unexpected increase to about 1.4 G followed by the cabin pitching around.

For the other one, why is the seat capable of interfering with controls? (Also, that doesn’t match the pilot’s story, which was that the screens cycled off and on, unless the seat can press the “reboot plane” button).

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#45

Post by WhackyIdeas »

ethbr1 wrote: post #43
WhackyIdeas wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I only just recently found out about Boeing’s involvement in making missiles which Israel uses in Gaza, it would unfortunately not surprise me if these particular conspiracy hypothesis are more than just hypothesis. At least for Boeing, they’ll be benefiting from the fear other potential whistleblowers may have. But it’s also possible that Boeing don’t know about the deaths because someone else has done it for the…

Didn't, but some reasons why? (a) You're starting from just finding out Boeing is a major defense contractor. (b) Everything after that is your opinions on conspiracy theories, without any content.

a) Defence? Sorry to be nitpicking here, but most of the world would say those missiles are being used for anything but defence.

b) So tell me, would Boeing benefit from whistleblowers being too scared to blow their whistles? If I am wrong to make that assumption, then please tell me why? AND for a business which provides the actual missiles which have wiped out around 15000 children, would that company have any qualms about a threat to their business disappearing?

What I said was logical. And there is no way you will be able to provide anything which is more logical and SANE than what I have said. But, I am OPEN to think about whatever reply you have.

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#46

Post by everforward »

leoh wrote: post #20

We really still sure this whole decompression sickness thing was just a “simulation”? https://www.reuters.com/technology/space/nasa-accidentally-b...

I don't think a "leak" would cause decompression sickness. Decompression sickness is caused by bubbles forming when pressure decreases too quickly for the body to expel now-excess nitrogen. A slow, gradual decrease would provide plenty of time to expel excess nitrogen.

A leak in a pressure vessel is basically how deep saturation divers re-acclimate to standard pressure, and they're making a much, much larger change in pressure (maximum of 14.5 psi delta on the ISS, ~429.06 for a saturation diver at 1000 ft). It's really a delta P of 10 psi though, since the American space suits are 4.5 psi. There's not really much point in talking about decompression sickness without a space suit; they'd die of lack of O2 or exposure even without DCS.

Current recommendations for space walks are a 4 hour denitrogenation period breathing 100% oxygen, and that's pretty cautious. That's based on the denitrogenation rate of the slowest tissues; it could likely be done significantly faster without presenting dramatically increased risks of DCS, and especially so if you only need to avoid type 2 DCS where the bubbles present a risk of dying.

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#47

Post by ethbr1 »

WhackyIdeas wrote: post #45
ethbr1 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't, but some reasons why? (a) You're starting from just finding out Boeing is a major defense contractor. (b) Everything after that is your opinions on conspiracy theories, without any content.

a) Defence? Sorry to be nitpicking here, but most of the world would say those missiles are being used for anything but defence. b) So tell me, would Boeing benefit from whistleblowers being too scared to blow their whistles? If I am wrong to make that assumption, then please tell me why? AND for a business which provides the actual missiles which have wiped out around 15000 children, would that company have any qual…

In American English, "defense" is commonly understood as "the military-industrial complex".

Your opinion can be logical, but everyone has their own opinion.

If you want suggestions, I'd recommend taking an approach of "What are you including in your comment that would interest or inform someone, versus the other millions of opinions on the internet?"

Or, 'Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive.' https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Also, while we're at it, 'Please don't use uppercase for emphasis. If you want to emphasize a word or phrase, put *asterisks* around it and it will get italicized.'

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#48

Post by ethbr1 »

everforward wrote: post #46
leoh wrote: post #20

We really still sure this whole decompression sickness thing was just a “simulation”? https://www.reuters.com/technology/space/nasa-accidentally-b...

I don't think a "leak" would cause decompression sickness. Decompression sickness is caused by bubbles forming when pressure decreases too quickly for the body to expel now-excess nitrogen. A slow, gradual decrease would provide plenty of time to expel excess nitrogen. A leak in a pressure vessel is basically how deep saturation divers re-acclimate to standard pressure, and they're making a much, much larger change i…

Also, this is helium from the propulsion system.

>> Helium is used in the spacecraft’s thruster systems to allow the thrusters to fire without being combustible or toxic.

I'm assuming it's used to backfill tanks as they're emptied?

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#49

Post by WhackyIdeas »

ethbr1 wrote: post #47
WhackyIdeas wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

a) Defence? Sorry to be nitpicking here, but most of the world would say those missiles are being used for anything but defence. b) So tell me, would Boeing benefit from whistleblowers being too scared to blow their whistles? If I am wrong to make that assumption, then please tell me why? AND for a business which provides the actual missiles which have wiped out around 15000 children, would that company have any qual…

In American English, "defense" is commonly understood as "the military-industrial complex". Your opinion can be logical, but everyone has their own opinion. If you want suggestions, I'd recommend taking an approach of "What are you including in your comment that would interest or inform someone, versus the other millions of opinions on the internet?" Or, 'Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less,…

I’m not from the USA nor am I going to be hoodwinked by American double think of ‘defense’. Batter in though.

Yes, opinions are like arsehole’s… everyone has one. However, for lack of logical opinions like mine in a sub thread relating to thoughts of conspiracy, I personally feel that mine does have the ability to spark a second thought about a situation. If you don’t agree, that’s your opinion.

And thanks for your tips on emphasism - highly interesting and informing.

Re: Boeing's Starliner Now Has 5 Leaks While Parked Outside the ISS

#50

Post by nomel »

fransje26 wrote: post #32
nomel wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it's not. > While Starliner is docked, all the manifolds are closed per normal mission operations preventing helium loss from the tanks, > “We can handle this particular leak if that leak rate were to grow even up to 100 times,”

If your propulsion system is developing leaks as you go, and, for good measure, you are also loosing thrusters in critical flight phases, than yes, this is terrifying. What you have is a known failing system, with a very high probability of additional failure as soon as it is repressurised and it enters its next stress cycle. Which is normally when these things like to fail.

> What you have is a known failing system

Absolutely not. Engineering in the real world doesn't work like this. You don't design for perfection. You have intentionally defined specs set to what can be intentionally accommodated in your design.

In this case you literally have is a system operating at 1% of the value that can be accommodated. That is not a problem. Something undesirable happening does not necessarily mean the system is failing, or that it's even a practical problem.

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