Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC • Hacker News Board

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#41

Post by jhoechtl » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 6:39 PM UTC

phone8675309 wrote: post #23

phkahler wrote: post #11

>> His divisional heads always had the same answer. Microcomputers—home computing—were a fad. They were low-cost and low-profit. Let others scrabble around in the metaphorical dirt of home computing. The real money was in the markets that IBM’s divisions already dominated—selling vast mainframes and minicomputer systems to large businesses. Cary was even told to buy Atari, which by then had established itself as Amer…

> Not sure how IBM folks could not see this opportunity just because it was smaller scale than "what they did" They thought it was a fad - that centralized systems (coincidentally, the machines they made) would be the computing platform that people would pay-per-minute/pay-per-hour/pay-per-month to access remotely. They wanted to be an information utility - a supplier to all - instead of selling a small, low margin b…

Are you talking about Microsoft Azure?

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#42

Post by garius » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 6:40 PM UTC

nabla9 wrote: post #30

Classic example of Worse is Better. All competing architectures were better than IBM PC architecture, PC BIOS was bad, chosen processor instruction set was the worst, MS-DOS operating system was bad. Only the keyboard was good. What made it winner was open architecture, 80-column screen and IBM name.

keyboard wasn't great either, to begin with!

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#43

Post by forinti » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 6:44 PM UTC

nabla9 wrote: post #30

Classic example of Worse is Better. All competing architectures were better than IBM PC architecture, PC BIOS was bad, chosen processor instruction set was the worst, MS-DOS operating system was bad. Only the keyboard was good. What made it winner was open architecture, 80-column screen and IBM name.

I did some historical research to understand why the PC caught on (it made no sense to my 1980s teenage mind).

A PC with 80 columns card, 64KB of RAM and a floppy drive cost about the same as an Apple II Plus with the same specs (US$2,700).

A BBC Micro would set you back about US$1,500 (£900). It didn't offer slots, but did have 80 columns standard. It also had a lot of ports.

You couldn't even argue that the 8088 was much faster than the 6502. BASIC ran a lot faster on the 2MHz Beeb than on the PC.

The only thing that makes sense to me is that the people who bought it on launch were planning to use more than 64KB of RAM (which was rather expensive then).

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#44

Post by elzbardico » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 6:46 PM UTC

AlbertCory wrote: post #35

One consistent theme you get from business history is: There is very little penalty for being wrong. There is often a huge penalty for being right, if the powers-that-be opposed you.

One of the biggest advantages of being young is still not knowing how real this can be.

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#45

Post by tracker1 » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 6:46 PM UTC

tromp wrote: post #3

It's rare that a tech story brings me to tears, but I couldn't help feel one swelling up when reading the final paragraphs. > Eventually, it was Wilkie who made the first move. Overwhelmed with emotion, his eyes red and swollen with grief, he stepped forward and detached the red rosette from the lapel of his suit jacket. It was the same one Don had given him years before. Leaning down, he gently placed the rosette on…

I feel the same way. The end of the story is just sad. I wish that more companies could break their own structures to offer rewards, bonuses and more freedom to teams like this. The kinds of people that thrive with these kinds of opportunities tend not to do as well with general corporate culture.

So many times a relatively small upstart team with enough freedom will accomplish greatness, only for corporate culture to completely destroy what was.

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#46

Post by tracker1 » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 6:48 PM UTC

phkahler wrote: post #11

>> His divisional heads always had the same answer. Microcomputers—home computing—were a fad. They were low-cost and low-profit. Let others scrabble around in the metaphorical dirt of home computing. The real money was in the markets that IBM’s divisions already dominated—selling vast mainframes and minicomputer systems to large businesses. Cary was even told to buy Atari, which by then had established itself as Amer…

They hamstrung and killed OS/2 similarly.

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#47

Post by garius » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 6:57 PM UTC

tracker1 wrote: post #46

phkahler wrote: post #11

>> His divisional heads always had the same answer. Microcomputers—home computing—were a fad. They were low-cost and low-profit. Let others scrabble around in the metaphorical dirt of home computing. The real money was in the markets that IBM’s divisions already dominated—selling vast mainframes and minicomputer systems to large businesses. Cary was even told to buy Atari, which by then had established itself as Amer…

They hamstrung and killed OS/2 similarly.

Yup. I'll be covering OS/2 when I look at operating systems in this period.

The level of foot-shooting by IBM on that one was ridiculous.

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#48

Post by endofreach » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 6:59 PM UTC

mellosouls wrote: post #4

For people who are interested in this era, Halt and Catch Fire is a terrific portrayal of the sorts of characters and battles that defined it, albeit from more of a startup perspective. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWrioRji60A

One of my favourite shows of all time. Wish there was more of it...

Thanks for the reminder to rewatch it. I really need that show now.

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#49

Post by ghaff » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 7:06 PM UTC

It might make an interesting business book--maybe I'll write it--what realistic business strategies companies that are widely viewed as failures could have followed though industry changes that boards/shareholders wouldn't have revolted about.

I'm not even sure IBM is a great example. It had a really rough stretch but is still there as a very profitable dividend-paying large corporation even if it's not considered cool.

Re: Don Estridge: A misfit who built the IBM PC

#50

Post by mrguyorama » Thu, Jun 06, 2024, 7:32 PM UTC

LaundroMat wrote: post #18

assimpleaspossi wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely horrible show and I advise people to not waste their time.

Why is that?

It's extremely contrived and deus-ex-machina all the way through.

The "history" the show goes over is crammed into it's Drama first story. The history is there for nostalgia bait, not to celebrate the history or educate. That's why pretty much everything interesting that happened in computing was mangled into coming from the same like 5 people.

And the characters are all just narcissistic assholes who are self destructive because it means the show gets to carry on for another season. It also has the cliche density to feel like a high schooler's homework project.

If you find yourself addicted to reality TV drama, you will enjoy it.

Imagine if you tried to take "It's always sunny in Philadelphia" seriously, and also were watching it because you cared about Philadelphia history. I felt actively patronized the whole time.