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We need motivation (good managers)

ethanalter.com

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Re: We need motivation (good managers)

#41

Post by brewdad »

JohnFen wrote: post #38
uoaei wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But literally every dev that I personally know Your bubble is absurdly tiny. I assure you this is not the norm across software engineering as a whole.

You have no clue how large or small my professional circle is. Since you claim to have knowledge about what is the norm across the entire field of software engineering rather than just the people in your own bubble, I assume that you have a study that informs your belief?

There are an estimated 28 million software developers in the world. How many millions do you know personally?

Your circle is incredibly small.

Re: We need motivation (good managers)

#42

Post by phantomathkg »

myhf wrote: post #29
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. There's a lot more to life than money; an unpopular stance for this crowd.

If you think there's more to life than money, then why are you so proud of underpaying your team members?

As a manger myself, I don't think OP is proud of underpaying his team.

We fight management for more salary for sure. At the end we are employee ourselves as well. But even at a medium size company, there are multiple layers even at an executive level you won't be able to talk to, for example, the board or VC.

What I believe OP trying to say here is that, despite all these, he did the best he can to maintain his relationship with his team, and motivate the best he can, and succeeded.

Re: We need motivation (good managers)

#43

Post by uoaei »

phantomathkg wrote: post #40
JohnFen wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have no clue how large or small my professional circle is. Since you claim to have knowledge about what is the norm across the entire field of software engineering rather than just the people in your own bubble, I assume that you have a study that informs your belief?

Maybe it is fair to say, probably 50% people develop for fun outside work, and another 50% don't?

That's an OK prior if you have literally no other information, but still isn't reasonable once you know anything about people.

Re: We need motivation (good managers)

#44

Post by kubanczyk »

zwieback wrote: post #23

After 30+ years as an engineer without reports I now spend more time motivating my managers to make them do what I want them to do vs. the other way around. I'll need to invert the advice in this post (if I can figure out what it's trying to say).

Whetever the message is, it's too weak a call. It sounds almost like they are saying mid managers should be paid more.

Re: We need motivation (good managers)

#45

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

saagarjha wrote: post #39
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatevs. I won't get into it. I've been called all sorts of evil names, here, because of my experience. I won't bother giving it much bandwidth. [Edit] > If you think there's more to life than money, then why are you so proud of underpaying your team members? HN has a rather ... predictable ... zeitgeist.

I mean this is like when people recount working with Steve Jobs: “he yelled at us a bunch but he also had a real eye for perfection that was really important in making sure we were doing the right thing”. Was he a good manager? Obviously the part where he knew what was good and what wasn’t could be part of that argument. But was the yelling necessary? Could things have been done without it? Should a good manager make…

I mentioned it as a challenge, not as a good thing.

I think I'm done, here.

Have a great day!

Re: We need motivation (good managers)

#47

Post by AzuraIsCool »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #45
saagarjha wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean this is like when people recount working with Steve Jobs: “he yelled at us a bunch but he also had a real eye for perfection that was really important in making sure we were doing the right thing”. Was he a good manager? Obviously the part where he knew what was good and what wasn’t could be part of that argument. But was the yelling necessary? Could things have been done without it? Should a good manager make…

I mentioned it as a challenge, not as a good thing. I think I'm done, here. Have a great day!

I read it as such too. Not sure why everyone got so upset.

Re: We need motivation (good managers)

#48

Post by AzuraIsCool »

myhf wrote: post #29
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. There's a lot more to life than money; an unpopular stance for this crowd.

If you think there's more to life than money, then why are you so proud of underpaying your team members?

PM is not CFO.

Re: We need motivation (good managers)

#49

Post by hayst4ck »

I am a little sad that there was no homage to autonomy, mastery, and purpose. I've found that to be the most accurate and simple framework for intrinsic motivation. I think purpose is the clear problem. How does working make you feel?

Pick your company and I think what might have started out as a venerable goal, expressed in a mission statement has long been forgotten:

  Google: Organize the world's information and make it universally accessible
  Facebook: Give people the capacity to form communities and bring the globe closer together
  Amazon: Amazon's mission is to be Earth's most customer-centric company
  Microsoft: Our mission is to empower every person and every organization on the planet to achieve more
When faced with the choice between mission and money, which companies are choosing their mission?

None of them. Because all of corporate America has one mission statement that decisions are made in regards to: Increase shareholder value by optimizing for next quarters profits.

That is the problem. Mission statements are a punchline for cynical employees.

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