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Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

lkml.iu.edu

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Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#41

Post by thrillgore »

ametrau wrote: post #27
thrillgore wrote: post #9

This is very uncharacteristic of the direction Linus was heading. Damn, Steven must have seriously fucked up. >You copied that function without understanding why it does what it does, and as a result your code IS GARBAGE. AGAIN. I generally believe in positivity but if I saw this as his direct report I'd move him to another project ASAP to get scrutiny on his code quality.

Do you also think in manager-speak? It’s our downtime, on a news discussion site, why are you still talking in this obnoxious way?

Thanks for the feedback.

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#42

Post by WhackyIdeas »

DiggyJohnson wrote: post #14
WhackyIdeas wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? I mean even if that guy was sneakily trying to implant a bug, I still couldn’t talk to him like that.

Just because you can't imagine yourself acting such a way doesn't mean that it falls outside the spectrum of "somewhat acceptable". It just means that you're probably way more careful with your emotions and tone than Linus. There's pros and cons to both, but in general, yea people are different.

Did you actually read through the entire thread of emails?

I did.

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#43

Post by hasty_pudding »

PH95VuimJjqBqy wrote: post #26
hasty_pudding wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish there was more of this in society instead of immense passive aggression we see now days. It's very efficient and to the point.

right, exactly. Linus has such a clarity of thought that if I disagree with him I have to examine why. Anything else is hubris imo, his track record speaks for itself. Perfect example is his infamous rant on why C++ wasn't used for git. He's a kernel developer, of course that's his opinion. I still love C++ but I'm certainly not offended by it.

what did he use?

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#44

Post by WhackyIdeas »

adastra22 wrote: post #15

The amount of support give by other posters here for Linus’ insane antisocial behavior is crazy. I would never, ever contribute upstream to Linux so long as Linus is involved. My time is too valuable to deal with his BS. He should realize the hostile environment he creates drives away contributors.

I agree, it is shocking.

And with my other comments being downvoted, it’s incredible that people are so up his arse that they live in a bubble thinking that it’s ok to belittle someone like that.

Imagine working under someone like that… wow.

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#45

Post by PH95VuimJjqBqy »

hasty_pudding wrote: post #43
PH95VuimJjqBqy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

right, exactly. Linus has such a clarity of thought that if I disagree with him I have to examine why. Anything else is hubris imo, his track record speaks for itself. Perfect example is his infamous rant on why C++ wasn't used for git. He's a kernel developer, of course that's his opinion. I still love C++ but I'm certainly not offended by it.

what did he use?

git was implemented in C.

Someone asked him why he didn't choose C++ for it and he went on a rant basically saying C++ was bad, people that use it are subpar programmers, and that one of the advantages of choosing C is to weed out people who think C++ would have been a good choice.

oddly enough I can't seem to find the original rant, if someone can provide that I'd be greatful.

edit:

to give context to my original post, Linus is a kernel developer, he's going to value things that the vast majority of developers don't because he's dealing with problems that the vast majority of developers don't.

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#46

Post by solarkraft »

riku_iki wrote: post #31
Amorymeltzer wrote: post #16

I really suggest looking at the reply: https://lkml.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/2401.3/04254.html > I know nothing about what they're talking, but the response appears reasonable and mature, seems to engage in the substantive issues without responding to the anger/flaming, and looks like it intends to de-escalate and move forward. Torvalds' reply to that is more measured https://lkml.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/2…

> but the response appears reasonable and mature I wouldn't say saying "If I knew ... was going to piss you off so much, I wouldn't have done that." is very mature.

Why? It signals that they respect Linus's feelings (and they really don't want to piss him off), which seems quite mature and de-escalative to me.

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#47

Post by scrubs »

thdespou wrote: post #35
youngtaff wrote: post #17

Why f#ck would anyone ever want to contribute to the Linux kernel when you’re in danger of being on the receiving end of a rant like that…

Because the stakes are high. Nevertheless you shouldn’t take this personally.

Yep. Essentially what Linus is saying is that he has got to have more time, more competence, more vigilance that he wants because the other side can't or won't. And it's a recurring problem.

Sometimes we want more control and can't get it. Frustrating. Sometimes senior people are sick and tired of control and want less. Frustrating!

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#48

Post by solarkraft »

youngtaff wrote: post #17

Why f#ck would anyone ever want to contribute to the Linux kernel when you’re in danger of being on the receiving end of a rant like that…

Because having your thing supported by mainline Linux makes interoperability a breeze and saves a lot of maintainership effort. There's a lot of money behind it. Dealing with the quality gate keeper is a cost of doing business.

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#49

Post by youngtaff »

thdespou wrote: post #35
youngtaff wrote: post #17

Why f#ck would anyone ever want to contribute to the Linux kernel when you’re in danger of being on the receiving end of a rant like that…

Because the stakes are high. Nevertheless you shouldn’t take this personally.

Well he should learn to communicate in away that doesn’t appear like he’s treating the other person like an idiot

Re: Linus Torvalds flames Google kernel contributor over filesystem suggestion

#50

Post by riku_iki »

solarkraft wrote: post #46
riku_iki wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but the response appears reasonable and mature I wouldn't say saying "If I knew ... was going to piss you off so much, I wouldn't have done that." is very mature.

Why? It signals that they respect Linus's feelings (and they really don't want to piss him off), which seems quite mature and de-escalative to me.

language is confrontational and impersonal.
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