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Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

noyb.eu

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Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#41

Post by HenryBemis »

brookst wrote: post #37
latexr wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> pay for services instead of being the product That cliché is no longer applicable (was it ever?) and repeating it only helps the worst infringers. You can pay and still be the product. Consider the streaming services which charge you but still serve ads, or physical appliances that you buy but send your usage habits to the manufacturer (like TVs). Paying is not a guarantee that a company will treat you or your priv…

You can wear a seat belt and still die in a crash. Nothing in life is a guarantee. It’s pure pedantry to hear someone say “I would rather pay than be the product” and to choose to interpret that as “I believe that paying always guarantees that the company will never also use indirect monetization”. Preferring business with direct monetization models is risk mitigation, not a naive (and incorrect) belief in a magic bu…

So next time you walk down the street, if someone crosses your path give them you wallet, phone, laptop, sneakers, jacket because "hey they may pull a knife on me"(?)

I say that where money can be made, money will be made. But we have laws and regulations, and when the Metas of this world play dirty, you can stick it to them. (in most cases it will be too little - too late)(but the solution is not to roll over)

Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#42

Post by thfuran »

brookst wrote: post #37
latexr wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> pay for services instead of being the product That cliché is no longer applicable (was it ever?) and repeating it only helps the worst infringers. You can pay and still be the product. Consider the streaming services which charge you but still serve ads, or physical appliances that you buy but send your usage habits to the manufacturer (like TVs). Paying is not a guarantee that a company will treat you or your priv…

You can wear a seat belt and still die in a crash. Nothing in life is a guarantee. It’s pure pedantry to hear someone say “I would rather pay than be the product” and to choose to interpret that as “I believe that paying always guarantees that the company will never also use indirect monetization”. Preferring business with direct monetization models is risk mitigation, not a naive (and incorrect) belief in a magic bu…

No, the naivety is in the belief that paying offers any privacy protection. It's not a seat belt; it's homeopathic snake oil.

Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#43

Post by roelschroeven »

afsag wrote: post #35
difosfor wrote: post #3

I also applaud this and personally would prefer to just pay for services instead of being the product, but I'm afraid this is not a popular opinion. People don't want to pay, at least not knowingly. I'm curious how this will play out.

Since running a business costs money, the only result that will satisfy organisations like noyb is that companies like Facebook disappear from the EU. You will read many people here in HN openly saying how they would like social media to disappear, not only for themselves, but for everybody else, including those who enjoy it.

NOYB is not inherently opposed to Facebook and other social media. It does fight against unlawful (and arguably unethical) tracking. If a company can't find a solid business model that works within the bounds established by law, that's not NOYB's problem.

NOYB is perfectly fine with companies making money by placing ads (as long as they preserve your privacy).

Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#44

Post by HenryBemis »

stavros wrote: post #23
HenryBemis wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That ONE person out of 300m in the EU bothered to chase this topic.

Yes, I'm asking who this "one person" is. This is being chased by NOYB, an organization of multiple people.

We don't know the name, the article states that the org is putting itself in front. I am not surprised someone doesn't want to get entangled with Meta and use his/her own resources to fight this beast.

Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#45

Post by latexr »

noirscape wrote: post #10

This is an interesting argument. I wonder how it would be handled if Facebook instead had a 2-tier system where both tiers were paid. So you'd have to pay a base fee to use Facebook (and get tracked) and then a premium tier to remove the tracking. Putting aside the obvious ethical issues with such a system (that are obviously the reason why NOYB is filing), the "as easy to withdraw as it is to give" setup would be ke…

> the "as easy to withdraw as it is to give" setup would be kept in such a situation I think.

Debatable. Let’s say the base fee was 1€ and premium was 1000000€. Not many people could afford the latter. Even if it were 25€, or 10€, or even lower, as long as there’s any price discrepancy, one is not as easy as the other.

Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#46

Post by avgcorrection »

HenryBemis wrote: post #22
stavros wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you mean NOYB? Aren't they a team?

That ONE person out of 300m in the EU bothered to chase this topic.

It’s a bizzarely opaque statement since the population of the EU is over 400M. (Meanwhile the US population is over 300M.)

Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#47

Post by sonicanatidae »

loa_in_ wrote: post #36

Meta missed the part where their reparation doesn't have to be an easy fix. They dug themselves into a hole

And why would they care when this will result in a fine that is less than they generate selling their user's lives to whomever.

Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#48

Post by replygirl »

tagyro wrote: post #27
HenryBemis wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I read this once: There are two kinds of people: those who want to make the world a better place and those who want to make enough money to afford to not care.

those who believe the above are mutually exclusive, and those who develop social infrastructure

Re: Meta unlawfully ignores the users' right to easily withdraw consent: complaint

#49

Post by aspenmayer »

guappa wrote: post #29
happytiger wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here here. Paying no longer protects anything. If anything, you’re more valuable as a data brokered account if you’re KYC verified as a real person: so in fact the opposite case is now often the reality. Consider that paying makes you prime rib for Sunday dinner from a data perspective: card verified PII. And do not forget that you can be assigned an ID and disassociated from your data, which can then be tracked anon…

*hear hear

Thank you. The one that always bugs me on HN is folks “pouring” over something when they really mean poring, or to pore over something.
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