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AMD may get across the CUDA moat

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Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#41

Post by AnthonyMouse »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #30

I am not so sure. Everyone knows that CUDA is a core competency of Nvidia and they have stuck to it for years and years refining it, fixing bugs, and making the experience smoother on Nvidia hardware. On the other hand, AMD has not had the same level of commitment. They used to sing the praises of OpenCL. And then there is ROCm. Tomorrow, it might be something else. Thus, Nvidia CUDA will get a lot more attention and…

This is what people complain about, but at the same time there aren't enough cards, so the people with AMD cards want to use them. So they fix the bugs, or report them to AMD so they can fix them, and it gets better. Then more people use them and submit patches and bug reporters, and it gets better.

At some point the old complaints are no longer valid.

Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#42

Post by wubrr »

javchz wrote: post #26

CUDA is the only reason I have an Nvidia card, but if more projects start migrating to a more agnostic environment, I'll be really grateful. Running Nvidia in Linux isn't as much fun. Fedora and Debian can be incredibly reliable systems, but when you add an Nvidia card, I feel like I am back in Windows Vista with kernel crashes from time to time.

Yeah, nvidia linux support is meh, but still much better than amd.

Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#43

Post by tibbydudeza »

sumtechguy wrote: post #20
klysm wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A simplistic economic take would suggest that the competition would result in lower prices, but given two players in the market who knows.

It is oligopoly pricing. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/o/oligopoly.asp With that few competitors pricing would not change much.

Price difference between 13900K and AMD Ryzen 9 7950x is not big - the latest 7950X3D is about on par with the higher clocked 13900KS as well.

Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#45

Post by binarymax »

quitit wrote: post #40
binarymax wrote: post #6

And the question for most that remains once AMD catches up: will the duopoly result in lower prices to a reasonable level for hobbyists or bootstrapped startups, or will AMD just gouge like NVidia?

I think in this case the changes needed to make AMD useful will open the market to other players as well (e.g. Intel). PyTorch is already walking down this path and while CUDA-based performance is significantly better, that is changing and of course an area of continued focus. It's not that people don't like Nvidia, rather it's just that there is a lot of hardware out there that can technically perform competitively,…

Last I checked I saw the H100 was about two gens more advanced for certain components (tensor cores, bfloats, cache, mem bandwidth) - but my research may have been wrong as admittedly I'm not as familiar with AMDs offerings for GPU.

Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#46

Post by Zambyte »

wubrr wrote: post #42
javchz wrote: post #26

CUDA is the only reason I have an Nvidia card, but if more projects start migrating to a more agnostic environment, I'll be really grateful. Running Nvidia in Linux isn't as much fun. Fedora and Debian can be incredibly reliable systems, but when you add an Nvidia card, I feel like I am back in Windows Vista with kernel crashes from time to time.

Yeah, nvidia linux support is meh, but still much better than amd.

Is it better than AMD? I have had literally no graphics issues on my 6650 XT with swaywm using the built in kernel drivers.

Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#47

Post by kinematikk »

IntelMiner wrote: post #27
mattnewton wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Re: startups, Geohotz raised a few million for this already. https://tinygrad.org/

Didn't he do what he always does. Rake in a ton of money, fart around and then cash out exclaiming it's everyone else's fault? The way he stole Fail0verflow's work with the PS3 security leak after failing to find a hypervisor exploit for months absolutely soured any respect I had for him at the time

Do you have a source on the stealing part? A quick Google search didn't result in anything

Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#48

Post by jauntywundrkind »

IronWolve wrote: post #2

Yup, thank the hobbyists. Pytorch is allowing other hardware. Stable diffusion working on m chips, intel arc, and Amd. Now what I'd like to see is real benchmarks for compute power. Might even get a few startups to compete in this new area.

Pytorch is just using Google's OpenXLA now, & OpenXLA is the actual cross platform thing, no? I'm not very well versed in this area, so pardon if mistaken. https://pytorch.org/blog/pytorch-2.0-xla-path-forward/

Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#49

Post by evanjrowley »

binarymax wrote: post #6

And the question for most that remains once AMD catches up: will the duopoly result in lower prices to a reasonable level for hobbyists or bootstrapped startups, or will AMD just gouge like NVidia?

AMD prices will go up because of the newfound ability to gouge for AI/ML/GPGPU workloads. Nvidia's will likely go down, but I don't expect it will be by much. The market demand is high, so the equilibrium price will also be high. Supply isn't at pandemic / crypto-rush lows, but the supply of cards useful for CUDA/ROCm still is.

Re: AMD may get across the CUDA moat

#50

Post by adastra22 »

IntelMiner wrote: post #27
mattnewton wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Re: startups, Geohotz raised a few million for this already. https://tinygrad.org/

Didn't he do what he always does. Rake in a ton of money, fart around and then cash out exclaiming it's everyone else's fault? The way he stole Fail0verflow's work with the PS3 security leak after failing to find a hypervisor exploit for months absolutely soured any respect I had for him at the time

Wow, TIL
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