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Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

bbc.com

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Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#41

Post by lancesells »

fodkodrasz wrote: post #18
mg wrote: post #8

This reminds me of a common theme in the art world. I wonder if there is a name for it. Maybe "Low effort art"? Examples off the top of my head: John Cage "composed" a song consisting of just silence. Marcel Duchamp exhibited a urinal which he simply purchased from a store. Yves Klein exhibited 11 paintings that were exactly the same. They were simply blue, no structures or subject. But he priced them all differently…

Classic postmodern. Shows the lack of something. Usually the lack of originality and the lack of any value.

Interesting take.

Could you cite some well-known artists that are postmodern and lack originality? Jeff Koons, Cindy Sherman, Basquiat, Richter? I understand if you don't like postmodern art but not original isn't a criticism in my eyes.

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#42

Post by neontomo »

mg wrote: post #8

This reminds me of a common theme in the art world. I wonder if there is a name for it. Maybe "Low effort art"? Examples off the top of my head: John Cage "composed" a song consisting of just silence. Marcel Duchamp exhibited a urinal which he simply purchased from a store. Yves Klein exhibited 11 paintings that were exactly the same. They were simply blue, no structures or subject. But he priced them all differently…

This is not entirely true, that it is low-effort. There is a lot to be said for coming up with an idea, which can take months or years, and what the idea will say about the art.

In Hong Kong, they were being detained and limited from protesting no matter what signs they were holding up, so someone had the idea of holding up blank pieces of paper. It's brilliant because it shows how oppression works - they still detained people - and the paper isn't explicitly saying anything political but still somehow it is. The implementation is easy (or low effort), but the idea itself is where the value is. And you have to come up with it.

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#43

Post by eldritch_4ier »

dreamcompiler wrote: post #20
mg wrote: post #8

This reminds me of a common theme in the art world. I wonder if there is a name for it. Maybe "Low effort art"? Examples off the top of my head: John Cage "composed" a song consisting of just silence. Marcel Duchamp exhibited a urinal which he simply purchased from a store. Yves Klein exhibited 11 paintings that were exactly the same. They were simply blue, no structures or subject. But he priced them all differently…

> John Cage "composed" a song consisting of just silence. I used to think 4'33" was the most ridiculously arrogant piece of pseudo-art in the history of pseudo-art. But people still talk about it today, 70 years after it was composed [0], and they will still be talking about it 500 years from now. So I've changed my mind. It does exactly what good art is supposed to do: It makes you ask questions. [0] https://en.m.wi…

Who decided that “good art makes you ask questions” or “art is about starting a conversation”? Sounds like an excuse for passing off garbage.

“The Course Of Empire” is a beautiful piece of art for many reasons: it’s clearly masterful, it represents complex ideas simply, it conveys emotions we lack words to convey, it beautifully displays the human experience, and so on. It’s art even if you didn’t have a human to experience it - it’s self evident.

Taping a banana to a wall isn’t art. A silent song isn’t art. These are just childish, amateurish displays only enjoyed by a nihilistic culture devoid of meaning. If what you make only counts as art because it “starts a conversation” about how stupid and garbage and insulting it is, then it’s not art at all.

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#44

Post by arghwhat »

exitb wrote: post #30
kryptiskt wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He got to keep his fee, what he didn't get to keep was the cash that he was lent that was supposed to be part of the installation.

But it makes the art worse if the money's returned. It's JUST an empty canvas then, not even worth keeping on the wall.

While the idea was slightly amusing, it was always just empty canvases. The artist just also breached contract and committed theft on the side, which is an unjustified crime that does not in any way enhance said blank canvas.

The criminal individual was not even punished, he just have to return the stolen goods and still get paid. If the museum had not chosen to display the canvas, I feel it would be fair to require damages on top of the money returned in full, without pay deducted and with interest.

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#45

Post by alexvitkov »

tromp wrote: post #5

And to think that these earlier Kazimir Malevich works from 1915 [1] and 1918 [2] were already considered minimalistic... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Square_(painting) [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_on_White

At least he had the human decency to tilt the white square 5 degrees. Or maybe it was an installation error

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#46

Post by jawilson2 »

circuit10 wrote: post #37
grodin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A major element of 4'33" is that it is impossible to experience silence. It was partly inspired by Cage's experience in an anechoic chamber. He'd expected to hear silence but could still hear sounds that were coming from himself (the story is that a sound engineer told him the sounds were his bloodstream and his nervous system, but I find it very hard to believe that what he heard was actually either of those things)…

> his bloodstream and his nervous system, but I find it very hard to believe that what he heard was actually either of those things Sometimes if it's really quiet I can hear something that seems to pulse at about the right speed that it could be blood flowing, so I don't find that very hard to believe? Or am I hearing something else?

I can definitely hear my pulse at night in bed, or after working out. This is definitely not too far-fetched.

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#47

Post by ycombinete »

mg wrote: post #8

This reminds me of a common theme in the art world. I wonder if there is a name for it. Maybe "Low effort art"? Examples off the top of my head: John Cage "composed" a song consisting of just silence. Marcel Duchamp exhibited a urinal which he simply purchased from a store. Yves Klein exhibited 11 paintings that were exactly the same. They were simply blue, no structures or subject. But he priced them all differently…

I saw one of the Klein Blue pieces at the Tate Modern last year.

I was surprised to find myself quite taken by it! It really is a striking colour, and an imposing presence overall!

I think about it all the time, and picture it in my house at least once a month.

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#48

Post by dagw »

fodkodrasz wrote: post #29
coldtea wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For lack of originality, those examples are all very original. For lack of artistic value, are all highly regarded by critics and art audiences. For lack of mometary value, they've been sold for very expensive prices...

You have a different definition of original than me, it seems. Critics and art audiences: totally no "opinion monopoly" or manufactured consent at play, right? Monetary value? You mean money laundering?

Are you sure you aren't attempting to judge originality with the benefit of hindsight? The fact that these works have been mindlessly copied countless times since they were first conceived and now appear trite and simplistic, doesn't make the original concept any less original.

As to the value and validity of the opinion of critics and art audience, surely the most import opinion about just about anything is the opinion of the intended audience.

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#49

Post by photoGrant »

mg wrote: post #8

This reminds me of a common theme in the art world. I wonder if there is a name for it. Maybe "Low effort art"? Examples off the top of my head: John Cage "composed" a song consisting of just silence. Marcel Duchamp exhibited a urinal which he simply purchased from a store. Yves Klein exhibited 11 paintings that were exactly the same. They were simply blue, no structures or subject. But he priced them all differently…

Sherry Levine.

It’s not low effort.

Unless that’s what you brought as a consumer of the art!

Re: Danish artist told to repay museum €67,000 after turning in blank canvasses

#50

Post by bj-rn »

mg wrote: post #8

This reminds me of a common theme in the art world. I wonder if there is a name for it. Maybe "Low effort art"? Examples off the top of my head: John Cage "composed" a song consisting of just silence. Marcel Duchamp exhibited a urinal which he simply purchased from a store. Yves Klein exhibited 11 paintings that were exactly the same. They were simply blue, no structures or subject. But he priced them all differently…

Found object maybe?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Found_object

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