Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office” • Hacker News Board

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#41

Post by FirmwareBurner » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 9:48 AM UTC

isilofi wrote: post #35

nikau wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its also lazy management. Remote work used to be an earned privilege for workers who were self sufficient and didn't need any management. Now everyone expects it, and lazy/weak managers will just make everyone come into the office vs having hard conversations with crap employees to tell them they cant work from home.

> Remote work used to be an earned privilege for workers who were self sufficient and didn't need any management. I'm coordinating with developers in Europe, South America and East Asia. The customers are all over, but mainly North American. I'm in Europe. I've seen some of the customers once or twice in person, I see many of my European colleagues at the yearly get-together. But all the contact and all the work is o…

Can I ask where in Europe? I'm also looking for something remote friendly as most companies in my area have pull everyone back in the office and I hate it.

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#42

Post by sgt101 » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 9:48 AM UTC

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #18

rgrieselhuber wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think more remote is inevitable. Think of how much time is stolen from you in a daily commute. Remote is better for the environment too.

It is, but companies are too stubborn.

As soon as the accommodation strategy needs a refresh this changes.

If you can reduce the office footprint you can save money. Bringing people in often means increasing the footprint post wfh.

Wfh will win where it actually succeeds because it saves money.

If it doesn't work then only companies that bring people in will succeed.

My feeling is that about 75% of the non manual non hospitality economy will go WFH

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#43

Post by alophawen » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 9:50 AM UTC

khuedoan wrote: post #29

Gigachad wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Think of how much time is stolen from you in a daily commute Not that much. And I just read hacker news while sitting on the train which I was going to do if sitting at home anyway.

Only if you live in a country with decent public transportation. The rest of the world still have to deal with traffic jam and polluted air while commuting (cars are difficult to get in many countries).

> Only if you live in a country with decent public transportation

So only in every country in the world except USA?

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#44

Post by epups » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 9:52 AM UTC

aurareturn wrote: post #12

lovich wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So is he either a figure head that can work remotely because he doesn’t matter, or is he doing “real work” and it turns out that working remotely does work? Execs like to paint working remotely as something that is wasteful and so the common employee shouldn’t be allowed to do so, while simultaneously extolling the virtues of their remote work. It’s reminiscent of the time I worked at one company and the chairman of…

Just read the article. He doesn't like to work from the office because he said he prefers to be on the road meeting customers. Meanwhile, the brand of WFH HN folks want is to not leave the house and interact with real humans in person. The only reason I said "co-ceo" is because I was responding to someone who, for whatever reason, thinks a multi-billion public company shouldn't have its CEO talk to customers.

> Meanwhile, the brand of WFH HN folks want is to not leave the house and interact with real humans in person.

You've made this statement a few times in this thread, have you considered this is nothing more than a strawman?

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#45

Post by KptMarchewa » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 9:53 AM UTC

Mandatum wrote: post #23

Stewart Butterfield must be having a very heavy celebratory drink this evening, likely Suntory.

Maybe he'll succeed with finally launching the MMO game at his third company.

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#46

Post by rgrieselhuber » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 9:56 AM UTC

alophawen wrote: post #43

khuedoan wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if you live in a country with decent public transportation. The rest of the world still have to deal with traffic jam and polluted air while commuting (cars are difficult to get in many countries).

> Only if you live in a country with decent public transportation So only in every country in the world except USA?

Not if you count rural areas. In Japan for example, commuting every day in many areas still requires a car or long train rides. And the sardine-packed trains at rush hours in the cities are literally soul-sucking.

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#47

Post by tyingq » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 10:06 AM UTC

DoreenMichele wrote: post #16

Eh, sounds like the title is possibly either poor communication or a comment cherry-picked for the purpose of being provocative. He seems to have some nuance and flexibility on the issue that some people lack.

It seems fair to use some amount of propaganda to push the "I want to work from home" agenda, since companies pushing "return to work" are also playing that same game.

I agree that he seems to have nuance on the topic, but the playing field seems to have already abandoned fair play.

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#48

Post by 2muchcoffeeman » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 10:15 AM UTC

rjh29 wrote: post #31

rgrieselhuber wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think more remote is inevitable. Think of how much time is stolen from you in a daily commute. Remote is better for the environment too.

Idk I loved my hour of walking every day. My mental health tanked when I became full remote.

I went back to waking up, getting dressed, making coffee, and going out for a walk and coming back home.

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#49

Post by monooso » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 10:15 AM UTC

flakeoil wrote: post #37

rgrieselhuber wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think more remote is inevitable. Think of how much time is stolen from you in a daily commute. Remote is better for the environment too.

Stolen? You were paid for and took the job you knew was a certain distance and commute away from your home. I believe employees have to start to get used to being paid less when working remote. People who work in an office or factory have to be rewarded for this commute. Some jobs cannot be made remote. I assume a lot of people working remote also like the fact that they can do the laundry, clean the house, do some e…

I agree that some jobs can't be remote, but that doesn't apply to the majority of tech jobs (and therefore HN readers).

Most of the people here (and at Salesforce) are paid, in theory at least, according to their skillset and the value they bring to a company.

Why should that pay differ depending on where someone is sitting when they deliver said value?

Re: Marc Benioff: “I don’t work well in an office”

#50

Post by hdjjhhvvhga » Sat, Sep 16, 2023, 10:16 AM UTC

rjh29 wrote: post #31

rgrieselhuber wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think more remote is inevitable. Think of how much time is stolen from you in a daily commute. Remote is better for the environment too.

Idk I loved my hour of walking every day. My mental health tanked when I became full remote.

I solved the same problem by imitating my morning and evening routine. That is, I wake up, get on my bike, and ride - but not to the city, but in the opposite direction, into the forest. I relax biking and come back home. Then my daily starts and I'm full of energy. After I'm done with all my tasks, I repeat the same procedure, just explore some different paths. When I come back home, I no longer think of my tasks.