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‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

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Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#41

Post by jurynulifcation »

c420 wrote: post #9
capableweb wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, Datura isn't something I'd use for healing, it's something I'd use to break down myself. The experience with that is unlike others, and not in a good way.

I'd liken it to the salvia experience.

I'd respectfully disagree. For the first part, datura is an anticholinergic neurotoxin, a deliriant. Salvia is a kappa-opioid dissociative, without any known toxicities. The important thing to keep in mind with salvia is minimalism. It has no tolerance to speak of, so nothing is lost by starting small, well smaller than you know will give noticeable effect. Then build up from there. (An effect of salvia overdose is 'automatic action', where your body moves on impulse without the intervention of your waking mind)

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#42

Post by Jerrrry »

Euphorbium wrote: post #38
Jerrrry wrote: post #35

DMT only lasts 10-15 minutes, and will be so overpowering, glorious, and delightful, that one can only compare it to losing one's virginity, or being born again. Mushrooms and LSD are way too longer/overrated and I fear those who haven't further explored the latent chemical/consciousness space misrepresent the dimension that, quite frankly, BETTER chemicals have to offer. Dont do shrooms, 4acoDMT is far superior. Don…

Mushrooms are incredibly varied, and I feel you just have not experienced good/strong mushrooms. I had trips which were indistinguishable from dmt.

I have, which is why I recommend beginners to NOT start with anything above a microdose of shrooms.

If you think tripping at near-DMT levels for that duration is something a noobie should experience, please do not trip sit or further give shamanic/healer advice.

Shrooms, especially alone, is the worst thing a beginner could start with, exactly because the potency between stems right next to each other vary wildy.

15mg of volumetrically dosed 4acoDMT with a -zolam is perfect, with no stomach pains because there is no metabolizing needed, it is a direct prodrug of psilocybin. Little body load, less mental, more visual.

It's a shame that, what, 6+ generations of synthetic awesomeness are suppressed because people think "shrooms" are more "organic and natural"

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#43

Post by amts »

neom wrote: post #12
selimthegrim wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do they cover datura?

Datura is a deliriant. I'm a strong advocate of psychedelics and have used almost everything, but Datura isn't something people should touch, it's very dangerous.

>>Datura is a deliriant.

Such definition includes very little context. You should try more functional, mindful set&setting based approaches.

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#44

Post by jurynulifcation »

Jerrrry wrote: post #42
Euphorbium wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mushrooms are incredibly varied, and I feel you just have not experienced good/strong mushrooms. I had trips which were indistinguishable from dmt.

I have, which is why I recommend beginners to NOT start with anything above a microdose of shrooms. If you think tripping at near-DMT levels for that duration is something a noobie should experience, please do not trip sit or further give shamanic/healer advice. Shrooms, especially alone, is the worst thing a beginner could start with, exactly because the potency between stems right next to each other vary wildy. 15m…

I do agree with the principle of minimalism. Great idea. Big fan of that idea. People should start low and ow. But holy shit. Please please please stop recommend benzodiazepines so casually.

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#45

Post by Jerrrry »

jurynulifcation wrote: post #40
Jerrrry wrote: post #35

DMT only lasts 10-15 minutes, and will be so overpowering, glorious, and delightful, that one can only compare it to losing one's virginity, or being born again. Mushrooms and LSD are way too longer/overrated and I fear those who haven't further explored the latent chemical/consciousness space misrepresent the dimension that, quite frankly, BETTER chemicals have to offer. Dont do shrooms, 4acoDMT is far superior. Don…

Please don't recommend people take Xanax recreationally. Benzodiazepines are fraught with danger. It is not something to take lightly. Your experiences are not universalizable. I appreciate your insight, and I'm glad you've found substances you enjoy. But please refrain from engaging in drug exceptionalism. The first and foremost consideration of engaging in a substance ought to be harm reduction. This is not one of…

>Please don't recommend people take Xanax recreationally.

There is no way you could of inferred that from my post in good faith.

Do not ever, EVER, give hallucogenic/psychoactive drug, to a new-comer, without having a benzo or nerve pill on hand.

Benzo's, when given appropriately, are the only way - chemically - to help absolve the uneasiness pre- and post- dosing.

Given set and mood are the most paramount factors, it IS recommended that those trying substances (esp. tryptamines) are in a well mind set when initiating.

Nobody is suggesting taking more than a threshold dose of benzo's for recreation. That is a near antithesis of the point of these miracle blessings we take for granted.

Although I do appreciate the concern, yes, you SHOULD have a chemical emergency exit, especially when initiating those on their maiden voyage to the other side of the consciousness spectrum.

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#46

Post by amts »

jurynulifcation wrote: post #41
c420 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd liken it to the salvia experience.

I'd respectfully disagree. For the first part, datura is an anticholinergic neurotoxin, a deliriant. Salvia is a kappa-opioid dissociative, without any known toxicities. The important thing to keep in mind with salvia is minimalism. It has no tolerance to speak of, so nothing is lost by starting small, well smaller than you know will give noticeable effect. Then build up from there. (An effect of salvia overdose is '…

Though toxicity seems the main difference, comment above is talking about experience and not molecular mechanisms of action.

In a similar vein, if someone would ask a distinguished professor of neuroscience to provide a full description of the exact brain molecular state that "generates" an exact salvia experience (including any communicative content), s/he would fail.

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#47

Post by deepnotderp »

Jerrrry wrote: post #35

DMT only lasts 10-15 minutes, and will be so overpowering, glorious, and delightful, that one can only compare it to losing one's virginity, or being born again. Mushrooms and LSD are way too longer/overrated and I fear those who haven't further explored the latent chemical/consciousness space misrepresent the dimension that, quite frankly, BETTER chemicals have to offer. Dont do shrooms, 4acoDMT is far superior. Don…

4-aco-Dmt and shrooms are both pro drugs of psilocin so they’re functionally the same molecule

DMT can be life changing to many people, me being one of them, but it’s also extremely powerful, scary, and not always a positively life changing experience

EDIT: I misinterpreted what you meant by the 4-aco-Dmt comment. I actually agree that it’s better than actual mushrooms, especially for beginners

2C-B is another less overwhelming option for beginners

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#48

Post by DigitalBison »

jurynulifcation wrote: post #40
Jerrrry wrote: post #35

DMT only lasts 10-15 minutes, and will be so overpowering, glorious, and delightful, that one can only compare it to losing one's virginity, or being born again. Mushrooms and LSD are way too longer/overrated and I fear those who haven't further explored the latent chemical/consciousness space misrepresent the dimension that, quite frankly, BETTER chemicals have to offer. Dont do shrooms, 4acoDMT is far superior. Don…

Please don't recommend people take Xanax recreationally. Benzodiazepines are fraught with danger. It is not something to take lightly. Your experiences are not universalizable. I appreciate your insight, and I'm glad you've found substances you enjoy. But please refrain from engaging in drug exceptionalism. The first and foremost consideration of engaging in a substance ought to be harm reduction. This is not one of…

If you don't mind my asking, is your caution about benzodiazepines out of concern for the addiction potential, the long-term effects (e.g. dementia risk), or something else (or a combination)?

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#49

Post by neom »

amts wrote: post #43
neom wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Datura is a deliriant. I'm a strong advocate of psychedelics and have used almost everything, but Datura isn't something people should touch, it's very dangerous.

>>Datura is a deliriant. Such definition includes very little context. You should try more functional, mindful set&setting based approaches.

Here is some context:

https://www.bionity.com/en/encyclopedia/Psychedelics%2C_diss...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deliriant

Re: ‘Psychonauts’ by Mike Jay review

#50

Post by fidrelity »

_a_a_a_ wrote: post #28
WallyFunk wrote: post #15

I recall Terrence McKenna (everyone's favorite historical psychonaut) saying "It's hard to do psychedelics". I agree with him. These things are dangerous when the set and setting is wrong, or if they're done at an off-kilter phase of your life, or that you simply over-indulge in them. I appreciate the mini renaissance period they're having these days, but these things need plenty of research before trying them. They'…

This sounds like the usual covert anti-drugs post that comes up every time, with sloppy claims and a total absence of facts. > or that you simply over-indulge in them duh. What isn't dangerous if you're stupid. > They're not something you do for a giddy high Weasel words 'giddy'. And I do use them precisely for a high. > One thing people need to do is integrate the various lessons they've gained from tripping into th…

'Assume good faith' is part of the HN guidelines.

Not OP, but as someone who had his first trip a couple of months ago, I can relate to a couple of points you're calling out.

Regarding integration: I have had appointments with a therapist specialised on integrating peak experiences and for me what worked was to have someone to discuss and extract meaning and insights from the trip and find 'hooks' how to make them part of daily life.

Regarding the amnesia, I can also relate. I still remember the insights, the lessons, the characters and the meaning of my trip. But it gets harder and harder to connect to the feelings of the trip, which in turn make the insights less 'sticky'.

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