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AI Crap

drewdevault.com

41–50 of 260 posts

Re: AI Crap

#41
post #4

I am another AI pessimist. Can I please ask the optimists to list the good things LLMs can do for humanity as a whole ? I don't mean banal stuff like Copilot, which is a double-edged sword that might be used against junior developers. I mean world-changing benefits, one step closer to the techno-utopia. Because on paper, the net benefits vs net negatives, for me and other AI pessimists like the author, are not worth…

I'm not a native English speaker and ChatGPT is the best existing tool to spell check and fix gramatical errors in emails. Copilot is another very useful application, and I think your dismissal of it is invalid. Even if we accept that Copilot hurts new devs (which I don't know if you have any proof but I'll make the concession that it is a possibility). A double edged sword hurts and helps the same person. I and half…

Does it help you learn better spelling and grammar, or do you just stop thinking about it? Is that a good thing long term?

Same with dev. Does it actually make you better, or does it make you not think about learning so much?

Re: AI Crap

#42
> What will happen to AI is boring old capitalism.

I see a lot of people want to blame capitalism, but look at any other system, and ultimately they all fail due to human greed. The only way to make capitalism work correctly is with regulation, because once monopolies and collusions are reached, the natural incentives disappear (i.e. the lowest cost service that delivers what the consumer values).

> Its staying power will come in the form of replacing competent, expensive humans with crappy, cheap robots.

Agreed. You will earn less money (relative to cost of living), tax will increase, but yet people will still pretend your quality of life has increased - but they haven't. Many services you now can't reach a human - at all. Emails have disappeared, phone lines have disappeared - I now have to waste 5 minutes speaking to a chat bot that I know cannot solve my issue for it to maybe allow me to type text to what it claims to be a human.

> LLMs are a pretty good advance over Markov chains, and stable diffusion can generate images which are only somewhat uncanny with sufficient manipulation of the prompt. Mediocre programmers will use GitHub Copilot to write trivial code and boilerplate for them (trivial code is tautologically uninteresting), and ML will probably remain useful for writing cover letters for you.

In a sense, most neural networks can be modelled as some form of Markov Model. What's becoming more obvious is that the structures of these models is super important, and there is still a lot to be learned.

> Self-driving cars might show up Any Day Now™, which is going to be great for sci-fi enthusiasts and technocrats, but much worse in every respect than, say, building more trains.

Cars are a decentralised transport (as much as a transport system can be), whereas a train is a centralised transport system. The internet is also a transport system, but with packets instead of people, and this has had great success with a mixture of centralised and decentralised transport mechanisms.

The biggest problem with trains is that you create a single point of failure and an unnatural monopoly. Your bandwidth is also heavily reduced due to safety considerations (you want to travel fast over long distances, but need to increase the safety margin to do so). Unlike cars or internet packets, you can't divert a train. One can imagine a new protest group "just stop energy" (instead of "just stop oil") quite trivially bringing an entire Country to a halt by placing cars on all of the tracks.

> AI companies will continue to generate waste and CO2 emissions at a huge scale as they aggressively scrape all internet content they can find, externalizing costs onto the world’s digital infrastructure, and feed their hoard into GPU farms to generate their models.

Interesting to see that none of the climate activists so far have gone for clear winners like crypto mining, or AI training. Instead they would rather keep making the life of the every-day person miserable, as if it isn't miserable enough already.

> You will never trust another product review.

You find that people pay for reviews anyway. Somebody I know gets sent Amazon products to review, and they get to keep the products. The more positive reviews you give, the more you get selected for future reviews. The only way around this is reputation - I find somebody you trust who has reviewed a product. It's why Linus Tech Tips (LTT) and the recent review scandal was important - they have a reputation and it does inform consumers about expensive computing equipment investments.

Re: AI Crap

#43
post #24
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A doctor for every person, a teacher for every child, available any time and for free.

>A doctor for every person, a teacher for every child, available any time and for free. I'm sorry... I'm supposed to trust my healthcare and child's education to a piece of software whose primary feature is its ability to effectively hallucinate and tell convincing lies? And assuming AI is at all effective, which implies valuable (which implies lucrative,) you expect services built on it to remain free? That's not ho…

No? It's exactly how everything worked so far.

Live performance (orchestra and operas) were for rich only. Beautiful paintings were for the noble and churches. Porcelain was something needed to be imported from another continent. Tropical fruits were so expensive that people rented them.

Now we have the affordable versions of them for everyone in developed countries, and the middle class in developing ones. Yes, often we just got inferior, machine-made or digital copies, but I personally prefer something inferior than nothing.

Re: AI Crap

#44
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Unfortunately, I suspect we will get a two-tiered system, where the "middle class" (whether that's disappearing is another question) can afford human content/human support/etc, and the working class are forced to endure poor experiences with AI generated content and so on Have you dealt with human support agents recently? It's just an exercise in gaslighting. I can't wait for AI to take over.

No. That is precisely the wrong attitude. It is the 'corporate' drive to push service to be cheaper (for them) that lead to outsourced and IP poor user services, which AI will take to a whole new level of bad. What should be desired, is a return to quality and respecting the user (or at least taking the time to understand them), which unfortunately seems unnecessary now with a global reach and unimpeded manipulation…

> which AI will take to a whole new level of bad.

Why do you assume that?

> What should be desired, is a return to quality and respecting the user (or at least taking the time to understand them), which unfortunately seems unnecessary now with a global reach and unimpeded manipulation and influence that can ignore demands for improvement.

I know the assumption is always that Big Greedy Co™ is hiring the worst possible employees to save money, but I think it's far more likely that the scale of work required far exceeds the labour required to provide it.

Re: AI Crap

#45
post #29
post #21

> Mediocre programmers will use GitHub Copilot to write trivial code and boilerplate for them (trivial code is tautologically uninteresting), and ML will probably remain useful for writing cover letters for you When I read things like this it makes me think the author hasn't used ChatGPT in their job yet. Here is a really simple example of how I used ChatGPT this afternoon that saved me, I would estimate, about 2 hou…

That sounds like a five-minute job.

I think this is why most managers take the estimates provided by developers, double them and then go up one unit of time.

Re: AI Crap

#46
I’m in my late fourties’ and have witnessed only a handful of transformative technologies in my time. Nothing in the last 15 years has given me that “tingly feeling” of excitement — you know, that feeling that we’re on the cusp of something transformative — than the recent progress in AI.

While the new AI frontier might be led by prohibitively expensive (and closed) large language models, we’re also seeing great grass-roots progress at a smaller scale with modest models trained by the developer community. I trained a baby GPT the other day using llama2.c for my own use cases.

It’s Linux vs Sun/Unix all over again.

Re: AI Crap

#47
post #4

I am another AI pessimist. Can I please ask the optimists to list the good things LLMs can do for humanity as a whole ? I don't mean banal stuff like Copilot, which is a double-edged sword that might be used against junior developers. I mean world-changing benefits, one step closer to the techno-utopia. Because on paper, the net benefits vs net negatives, for me and other AI pessimists like the author, are not worth…

When you say someone should list all the good world changing benefits to counter your suggestions, it means you're expecting world changing negativity. That means you're envisioning a future where LLMs are so powerful that they actually cause huge societal impacts but somehow they can't detect spam, or make customer service more effective, make the general populace smarter? You're asking a for an answer that you by d…

Here's one positive use of AI: detection of shark species by drones to inform lifesavers as to whether a beach should be closed or not. This saves both shark and human lives, and is likely more cost effective than other methods (e.g. nets). Noticeably, it's the choice of data (i.e. not ingesting the labour of others without recompense), and how it's used, that make it very different to the various products that startups are producing. But it's the startups (and their owners) that will profit from misuse.

Re: AI Crap

#48
> Contrary to the AI doomer’s expectations, the world isn’t going to go down in flames any faster thanks to AI. Contemporary advances in machine learning aren’t really getting us any closer to AGI, and [...] What will happen to AI is boring old capitalism. Its staying power will come in the form of replacing competent, expensive humans with crappy, cheap robots.

This type of reasoning is really getting on my nerves lately.

Predicting the future is hard, yeah. But your predictions don't become systematically more accurate just by tackling "boring" and "capitalism" to them.

A lot of technologies can change our societies in emergent, non-boring ways. Climate change is an emergent effect of fossil fuel usage that you wouldn't predict by just looking at 19th century factories and imaging how they would evolve with "boring capitalism". The internet is extremely non-boring and has had profound effects on our society. Nuclear mutually-assured destruction is an extremely non-boring existential threat.

It could be that the dangers of AI is from the military, or the police, or terrorists, or from corporations seeking to replace labor, other conventional threats we already have a reference frame for, yes. Or it could be a completely novel from of disaster, like the equivalent of a school shooter getting AlphaFold 8 to make a novel virus that kills 70% of the population before we even realize there's a pandemic going on. Just because this isn't something we're used to doesn't mean it's fundamentally unlikely to happen.

Re: AI Crap

#49

As with much of this author's content this is a strong opinion that lacks nuance, but I basically agree with the fundamental assertion: that the lasting impact of this AI bubble will be to further centralise power, taking it away from workers. My hope is that a desire for authenticity prevents this from happening – whether that's a strong bias towards human content creators, towards speaking to a human on the phone f…

AI is the only way for small countries to compete with Hollywood. I'm sick and tired of all those glorified stage plays that my country produces simply because we have no access to Hollywood money.

Meanwhile Hollywood has so much money that they don't know what to do with it - they give it to directors like Michael Bay to create all those pointless cgi-fests.

Re: AI Crap

#50
post #4

I am another AI pessimist. Can I please ask the optimists to list the good things LLMs can do for humanity as a whole ? I don't mean banal stuff like Copilot, which is a double-edged sword that might be used against junior developers. I mean world-changing benefits, one step closer to the techno-utopia. Because on paper, the net benefits vs net negatives, for me and other AI pessimists like the author, are not worth…

I'm not a native English speaker and ChatGPT is the best existing tool to spell check and fix gramatical errors in emails. Copilot is another very useful application, and I think your dismissal of it is invalid. Even if we accept that Copilot hurts new devs (which I don't know if you have any proof but I'll make the concession that it is a possibility). A double edged sword hurts and helps the same person. I and half…

As someone on the receiving end of these types of LLM enhanced emails, I'd say just make sure you actually can be confident it is indeed communicating your message properly.

I work with a guy who has been covering up his poor use of the English language and it's been quite weird to be honest.

Fluent soudning emails full of convincing sounding gibberish is what I've been receiving. Unfortunately the guy just isn't good a communicating his ideas using written language and the LLM can't really fix that.

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