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Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

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Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#41

Post by bri3d »

Retric wrote: post #32
throwaway049 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've submitted a correction for an illegal turn instruction twice on Google maps. No reply. But my other corrections have been accepted.

Map creators include intentionally incorrect information (Map Traps) so people copying them are obviously copying them. I sometimes wonder if that’s the root cause of companies failing to correct some of their mistakes . https://www.gislounge.com/map-traps-intentional-mapping-erro...

Using anything that could cause incorrect directions as a trap location / trap street would be a ridiculously bad idea. I strongly suspect the reason is a more standard corporate one; the volume of corrections and signal to noise ratio is probably quite poor.

In the case of my repeated Uber map correction attempt, I suspect that my correction isn't prioritized because of two factors: first, the turn which Uber Maps suggests, while both illegal and very dangerous, is not impossible (it's an illegal left turn accomplished by making a U-Turn around an island designed to prevent left turns). So, they probably see enough volume of "driver completed route as suggested" data signals to ignore any "but it's illegal and dangerous" complaints, a classic problem with "data driven" systems. And, Uber don't seem to have a real process for riders to submit mapping corrections, only drivers, so my request is unlikely to ever be routed to the correct queue to begin with.

Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#42

Post by ikawe »

thallavajhula wrote: post #20

The way they made it sound seemed like they built a new solution for the maps. Them using OSM over Google Maps doesn't seem like it is too much of a big deal due to Lyft's limited presence.

In some sense OSM is "just" the database — what things exist and where are those things.

A mapping product like Google/Apple Maps includes a lot more functionality that often gets taken for granted.

For instance: - A geocoding search engine to find places by name, address, or description - navigational directions - tiling and other data distribution (which is both software and hardware) - styling and UI

There is a huge variety of open source options for this functionality, but it's hardly a plug and play thing, and quality varies wildly. Putting it all together is no small feat.

Disclaimer: I work on Headway (https://about.maps.earth) which is trying to make this kind of thing easier.

Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#44

Post by uneekname »

otterley wrote: post #23

The tone of this article is troubling. First, the focus is on savings to Lyft, and not how this innovation benefits customers in any way. Second, it is highly antagonistic to Google - who is probably still a partner to Lyft in many other aspects (advertising etc). Taking shots at your partners is generally considered bad for business.

It may be antagonistic, but Google Maps really isn't the one-stop shop it used to be in the mapping world. Companies like Lyft have been looking for alternatives for a while now.

Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#45

Post by fshbbdssbbgdd »

sushisource wrote: post #17
bri3d wrote: post #3

Does anyone know if Lyft plan to contribute their map corrections back to OSM? They mention other companies doing so in this blog post, but don't make it clear whether or not they, too, intend to. I'm curious to see how good Lyft Maps is, too. Uber Maps is, frankly, a disaster in my area, frequently suggesting illegal and/or impossible turns. I try to submit map feedback every trip (very hard as a rider, as most form…

I also find it consistently obnoxious that there is essentially no way to say "My driver was fine, but your platform did something stupid" when leaving feedback. At least, not without jumping through a million hoops. The arrogance of our industry is tiresome. I took a ride in SF a while ago and it predicted a 3 minute pick up time which turned out to be 25 minutes - no fault of the driver, and the only way I could co…

I think for users who comparison shop between Uber and Lyft, the pickup ETA is part of each app’s bid. Putting a lower price costs them money, while putting a lower ETA is free.

Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#46

Post by pietervdvn »

Retric wrote: post #32
throwaway049 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've submitted a correction for an illegal turn instruction twice on Google maps. No reply. But my other corrections have been accepted.

Map creators include intentionally incorrect information (Map Traps) so people copying them are obviously copying them. I sometimes wonder if that’s the root cause of companies failing to correct some of their mistakes . https://www.gislounge.com/map-traps-intentional-mapping-erro...

Map Traps (as these are called) are normally pretty harmless, e.g. a non-existent, small cul-de-sac that doesn't exist. A turn restriction (which is quite invisible!) seldom is.

Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#47

Post by everybodyknows »

> removing the distracting clutter of irrelevant stores, restaurants

This much at least makes strategic sense, with Google continuing to ratchet up intrusive advertising. How long I wonder before we see, say, animated icons for "selected" cell phone stores?

Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#48

Post by bri3d »

uneekname wrote: post #35
bri3d wrote: post #3

Does anyone know if Lyft plan to contribute their map corrections back to OSM? They mention other companies doing so in this blog post, but don't make it clear whether or not they, too, intend to. I'm curious to see how good Lyft Maps is, too. Uber Maps is, frankly, a disaster in my area, frequently suggesting illegal and/or impossible turns. I try to submit map feedback every trip (very hard as a rider, as most form…

Lyft is one of the biggest contributors to OSM. Here is a list of OSM accounts related to Lyft [0]. In many places where I've edited OSM, Lyft employees have contributed quality data where there wasn't any before. How (and, how respectfully) companies should contribute to OSM is an ongoing debate. But corporate influences are often a good thing, and I think nearly anyone would agree that Lyft's contributions to OSM h…

Isn't this the driverless car team, vs. the ride-mapping team?

Regardless, it's good to see that they are contributing back to OSM. I agree that overall the use of OSM by anyone "lifts all ships" as long as users continue to contribute back. OSM is one of the most positive projects around lately in terms of taking something that used to be extremely expensive and highly restricted and democratizing it.

Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#49

Post by Twirrim »

acslater00 wrote: post #43
DoctorOW wrote: post #6

This is yet another "We found a community project providing us with billions of dollars in free work but don't find it worth the effort to contribute anything back"

Lyft contributed essentially everything back to OSM

So this is another example of HN commenters getting up on their high horse before gathering facts? Say it isn't so!

Re: Lyft’s plan to take control of its maps and its future

#50

Post by dpflan »

The title here is missing a key word from Lyft's post: "secret", for the "secret plan". I thought map ownership/dominance was a key idea, like a decade ago, when Lyft and Uber started. Interesting that the issue was OSM wasn't robust enough until now. Was Lyft actively assigning engineers to work on OSM (or waiting?); couldn't that have accelerated OSM's path to robustness? This idea certainly takes time to develop into reality, but it seems like a lackluster idea to post now, in hopes of making Lyft more robust itself, but it's hard to not be cynical about stock price bump PR releases.
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