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The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

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Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#41

Post by smarx007 »

jiggywiggy wrote: post #34
smarx007 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you actually read the proposed text of the AI act? I certainly want more oversight over a medical startup or airplane manufacturer doing AI in the essential system components than otherwise. I think adding a high-risk category is a brilliant move.

The problem with this type of regulation is that you need to add huge amount of vagueness in the law to be future proof. Leading to huge amounts of uncertainty for companies, unnecessary red tape and higher legal fees. As well as giving the power to a judge to punish companies if the public sentiment goes negative.

TÜV certification is the red tape I want. Just how in the North America people respect appliances with UL marking.

But regarding the uncertainty, I agree with you. And I guess, it's inevitable given the pace of change and innovation. I am expecting more ISO standards to be created and updated in response to the AI Act, which will limit the uncertainty to some extent.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#43

Post by aerhardt »

neximo64 wrote: post #27
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's not neutering, it's pest control

I'm assuming you're typing this with the comfort of some kind of blink or webkit based web browser, made by said pests

I’m assuming you’ve benefitted to some extent from GDPR making it harder for companies to laugh their way to the bank with your data, even if you don’t live in the EU.

And to be clear, I pretty much agree with your sentiment; the EU is overzealous and the US is light-years ahead in digital tech - and not only or mainly due to regulation. But let’s not pretend the US culture of “just do it and inshallah” is all rainbows and sunshine. With AI in particular there are existential or quasi-existential risks.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#44

Post by galleywest200 »

School-Cotton wrote: post #11
roenxi wrote: post #6

In theory I probably do agree with the bill as presented in the article, there are 2 reservations that should be bought up. Firstly, the EU has a history of crippling their native tech industry to the general detriment of the EU. It is quite possible that this will end up being one more nail in the coffin. Secondly, they're fighting economics on this one. AI seems to be cheap and accessible. In practice controlling t…

Nazism is in fact banned in many European countries.

That may be true, but those countries still see the "parades" by these groups. Its "banned" but not gone.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#45

Post by dandellion »

School-Cotton wrote: post #11
roenxi wrote: post #6

In theory I probably do agree with the bill as presented in the article, there are 2 reservations that should be bought up. Firstly, the EU has a history of crippling their native tech industry to the general detriment of the EU. It is quite possible that this will end up being one more nail in the coffin. Secondly, they're fighting economics on this one. AI seems to be cheap and accessible. In practice controlling t…

Nazism is in fact banned in many European countries.

Usually what they have are bans to the display of nazi symbolism, or holocaust denial and things like that. Banning something intangible like an ideology is not very feasible, it's usually more about minimising expressions and influence.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#46

Post by soulofmischief »

cmilton wrote: post #42

Why do we assume evil? How do our unfounded decisions today affect the possibilities of progress? How easy will it be to repeal these laws when we find the harm they may cause? I would prefer to wait and see.

In the current climate, and generally, you should distrust your government on a systematic level, and take pride in doing so. They certainly distrust you.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#47

Post by endisneigh »

aerhardt wrote: post #43
neximo64 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm assuming you're typing this with the comfort of some kind of blink or webkit based web browser, made by said pests

I’m assuming you’ve benefitted to some extent from GDPR making it harder for companies to laugh their way to the bank with your data, even if you don’t live in the EU. And to be clear, I pretty much agree with your sentiment; the EU is overzealous and the US is light-years ahead in digital tech - and not only or mainly due to regulation. But let’s not pretend the US culture of “just do it and inshallah” is all rainbo…

> With AI in particular there are quasi-existential risks

lol, there really are not. It's hilarious to see the upper echelons of many government's unironically believing this. they should definitely keep an eye on the development, but as of yet it is not even close to an existential risk.

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#48

Post by konschubert »

wongarsu wrote: post #31

In general I find the EU AI act quite reasonable. There are a couple AI uses that will be prohibited (most mentioned by the article, mostly manipulating people or dystopian government stuff). But imho the meat of the act is in categorizing many use cases as "High Risk", which comes with a list of requirements. Things like putting some effort in thinking about risks, into your training data, understanding biases, havi…

The effect is going to be that all the innovation happens elsewhere, big AI companies will develop outside Europe.

And Europeans will only get to benefit as consumers, not as makers of AI.

And the EU will take that as a reason to regulate even harder and then also somehow end up giving a bunch of money to its telcos.

EDIT:

My point is that regulation doesn’t just prevent “bad products”. The compliance overhead also prevents good products.

That being said, I agree that there are certain decisions and actions that always should require a human appeals process

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#49

Post by themitigating »

dhfbshfbu4u3 wrote: post #20

They could've released this at any point over the last few years, then worked together with industry to refine the conditions. Instead, they waited too long and now it's going to be a regulatory mess. The big winners here will be the lawyers.

Do people also win or can only one party win?

Re: The EU AI act is coming, this time for real probably

#50

Post by gumballindie »

> While the AI Act’s references to copyright issues in generative AI are still very vague and only stress how much of a grey area it is, requiring providers of large models to be more transparent about their sources seems not a bad thing as such. As many aspects of the act it will be seen how this works out in practice.

If my license prohibits use of my work for ai training, or requires that any modified code includes my license or credits, or i lack a license, or my web blog doesnt give you permission to train against my content then you shouldnt use it. Google tried hijacking content with amp and ai is not different from it. If you violate my terms then i want to be able to submit evidence - or suspicion - to a government agency that audits or fines you to oblivion. Ideally you have to pay damages equal to the number of people that you may have sold my content to, in full or partially.

This would lead to a win win setup. Artists, developers, writers, lawyers and so on would need compensation for training content - one time or ongoing - leading to higher quality models, job growth and a superior ai product over all.

Ai is by and large a net positive but needs to be done right.

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