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Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

squareup.com

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Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#41

Post by jefftk »

jedberg wrote: post #24
munch117 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never seen a toll bridge that doesn't have tolls in both directions. I didn't even know that charging in only one direction was a thing. You live and you learn.

As I am also learning today. If you don't mind sharing, where do you live? Here in the Bay Area all of our bridges only have tolls in one direction.

Also tolls crossing into NYC. Since going around is impractical, it means you need half as much tolling. And since the land for tollbooths would be more expensive on the NYC side your savings are even larger.

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#42

Post by ajaimk »

bombcar wrote: post #16
jedberg wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on this article it sounds like they pay enough to want a law to make it less: https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/20/business/credit-card-fees-vis... Costco gets away with 0% because they offer exclusivity and because they cover some of the cost of the rewards programs. I guess Walmart et al did the math and figured they would lose too much business. The average Costco shopper makes over $100K a year, so getting anothe…

I was specifically wondering about the refund cost; I wonder if Walmart is eating the 1-3% on all refunds (I suspect the stores that DO eat it are the ones that really want to refund as store credit).

Walmart pays a lot less than 1-3%

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#43

Post by gowld »

latchkey wrote: post #26

This will affect businesses that do 3rd party merchant services, like events. If the event is cancelled, refunds are issued. Who pays that fee? It would be up to the business to try to claw back funds from the promoter of the event... who is now bankrupt from not being able to do their event. It gets ugly fast.

Those businesses don't get a refund on their electricity costs from cancelled sales.

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#44

Post by DaiPlusPlus »

jedberg wrote: post #13
bombcar wrote: post #8

Does anyone know if the "real big" merchants like Walmart have to pay the fee? I assume they're so large they can sit on the processors and squeeze them (I know Costco does, they pay 0% fees in-store because Visa is so hungry to be their processor).

Based on this article it sounds like they pay enough to want a law to make it less: https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/20/business/credit-card-fees-vis... Costco gets away with 0% because they offer exclusivity and because they cover some of the cost of the rewards programs. I guess Walmart et al did the math and figured they would lose too much business. The average Costco shopper makes over $100K a year, so getting anothe…

> The average Costco shopper makes over $100K a year...

While technically true, that statistic is misleading as it requires further qualification, namely that $100k figure only applies to shoppers in Costco's PNW area - not nationwide, and certainly not internationally.

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#45

Post by shagie »

jedberg wrote: post #24
munch117 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never seen a toll bridge that doesn't have tolls in both directions. I didn't even know that charging in only one direction was a thing. You live and you learn.

As I am also learning today. If you don't mind sharing, where do you live? Here in the Bay Area all of our bridges only have tolls in one direction.

Fairly standard around Chicago area. Results for Illinois Tollway Plaza will show them (not all of them are - they can get interesting at intersections and off-ramps).

(late edit)

This is largely driven by the question "is a vehicle heading in one direction likely to return in the other?"

For trips from Oakland to SF, yes - it is very likely that the vehicle will go back across the bay bridge back to Oakland (rather than heading down to San Jose and then back up the other side).

On the other hand, a vehicle driving on the tollway through Chicago may be heading up to Minneapolis or to Detroit and then to other directions. Trips on the Illinois tollways are less likely to have a return trip and so both directions need to be tolled to capture the vehicles. It costs twice as much to do this (twice as many toll booths and staff) and so given the choice (trips to an island or other geographically isolated area) they only pay tolls in one direction.

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#46

Post by trebecks »

jedberg wrote: post #24
munch117 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never seen a toll bridge that doesn't have tolls in both directions. I didn't even know that charging in only one direction was a thing. You live and you learn.

As I am also learning today. If you don't mind sharing, where do you live? Here in the Bay Area all of our bridges only have tolls in one direction.

some nyc bridges and tunnels charge both ways. for the bridges and tunnels connecting ny and nj, you only need to pay going nj -> ny.

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#47

Post by gowld »

jarym wrote: post #32

I guess the days when refunds were frictionless so that consumers could purchase with confidence are gone? Refunds have always been a cost of doing business - it just seems the processors / card companies want to change the rules and have their cake and eat it now that cash is mostly dead.

Refunds are still frictionless for consumers. It's vendors who have to maintain product quality and prevent fraud to avoid returns. It's not Square's job to make sure that a vendor's product is high-quality or that customers really want to keep the products they buy.

Credit cards mostly work the same way.

https://www.cardfellow.com/blog/credit-card-refund-fees

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#48

Post by AlexandrB »

brianwawok wrote: post #33
sparrish wrote: post #6

This is now pretty standard across the industry. PayPal made the same change last year.

Sadly users still expect refunds for any reason. Charging a 3% fee on a refund is a cause for a shtfit.

Why sadly? This is basic consumer protection stuff. It seems like currently this fee ends up being paid by the vendor or some middleman, but that seems like BS too. Visa/whoever should be returning the fee and folding it into their business model as the cost of doing business.

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#49

Post by gowld »

LatteLazy wrote: post #40

Devils advocate: this penalises businesses with a LOT of refunds. Which is probably a good thing. Because they generate a lot of work for square and are doing something wrong commercially (misadvertising?). And SHOULD be discouraged...

What work do they generate for Square?

It's not really "Devil's" advocate to advicate for the current standard practice across the industry.

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