Would this work in a JS+HTML AIR app? The Plura for websites iframe code seems like it would work if you got the AIR sandbox requirements right. Also, what is the average CPU percentage your developers run on their clients systems?
No, we tried to do this, but we can't run Plura in Adobe AIR. AIR uses Webkit for its browser, but Adobe has removed support for browser plugins, including Java.
Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
41–50 of 58 posts
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#42Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yep, we quite aware of all of these issues. My background is in HPC and my previous company was a successful exit to a major oilfield services firm. My software and its descendants are used on nearly 100,000 CPUs. We are definitely focused on the applications that have extremely high compute/io ratios. In general, these boil down to either high compute problems with no real data or problems where the data can be shar…
So that brings up a good issue, namely the proprietary nature of the code you're distributing. For instance, stock market analysis firms zealously guard their algorithms. Let's say I'm a potential customer: How will you protect my bytecode from being stolen by competitors when it has to be run on unmanaged machines in the wild?
There is some protection in the fact that you never know what type of work unit is happening at a given time. The algorithms are typically each snippets of code instead of full applications, so someone would need to piece together quite a lot of information.
Of course, if someone is particularly concerned, they can run a jar obfuscator.
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#43Monthly payment = $2.60 times # avg. simultaneous users times CPU % It sounds dishonest to summarize this as 2.60$ per user per month. It is 2.60$ per user, if that particurlar user plays non-stop for 30 days straight, assuming 100% CPU In other words, you get 1 cent per 3 hours of play time. To get 100$ per month, you need 10000 users, playing one hour every week or so. (hopefully, my math and interpretation is corr…
We put it in terms of average simultaneous users because that's the way a lot of affiliates think. They say, we have an average of N people playing the game at any given time. For websites and other affiliate types, we say we pay $15/MWU (million work units) where a work unit is 15 seconds on an average node (the system-wide Plura average node performance).
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#44How do your paying customers feel about their data being strewn about the Internet? How does your processing interfere with the game that the user is playing? What kind of problems have you earmarked as being particularly parallelizable like this (ie what is your marketing plan?), and how usable is your API?
At the end of the day, is going through the effort to rewrite a program to work on distributed Java applets going to produce substantially more processing for the customer dollar than a $150 headless dual-core 1gz board with a gig of RAM running C++? You say that you can provide a $1500/yr savings over EC2, but this is only for applications that are "embarrassingly parallel", and will certainly require hiring a programmer to write code to run in tiny chunks on lots of clients. Will this cost less than $1,500? Worse, it will be money up front instead of spread out over a year.
You could say that the system is best leveraged by clients looking for a lot of compute power on a budget, but those are the people most likely to build their own grid. When you can get linux running on a dual-core 2.0gz for $200 / node, spending that money every year on an untested platform that will require substantial development work and vendor tie in, your service is going to be a tough sell.
You will be the only people interested in writing code for this platform, so please repost when you know which algorithm you can run to gross $10 million a year.
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#45Are there ample warnings to, or explicit agreement with the user that his/her CPU time is going to be used by non-game functions? This seems suspiciously like theft of services. When I run any process I expect it to restrict all its actions to servicing direct functions related to that process. Plura is expressly unrelated to ANY process/game it is bundled with. I would personally be annoyed/angry that a program I wa…
Thanks for the comments. We really try to be above board, include it in TOS, and encourage disclosure to the users. I mentioned this in another response, but we even have some affiliates that do some sort of opt-out procedure. Our hope is that the users end up reaping the benefits from this via increased development dollars or reduced ads. We have some affiliates that are exploring ways of giving some form of in-game…
Legally speaking if the game (or whatever) doesnlt make 100% clear what is going on ("we are going to be using your CPU") then I'd say it's very shaky territory.
Also I am pretty sure that in a lot of countries you would be pretty much required to either have a splash saying "click yes to play this game and work some units" or have a workable opt out (I dont know if that exists??)
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#46---
"After receiving the WU, the user's computer will perform the computation. The game developer can control how much of the user's CPU is devoted to computation by setting the % usage (either statically or dynamically)."
How do you accurately control the amount of CPU a program takes in user-space? Can you really have a process that will restrict itself to using no more than 25% CPU? (Also, 25% of a fast CPU is more than 25% of a slow one)
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#47Would this work in a JS+HTML AIR app? The Plura for websites iframe code seems like it would work if you got the AIR sandbox requirements right. Also, what is the average CPU percentage your developers run on their clients systems?
No, we tried to do this, but we can't run Plura in Adobe AIR. AIR uses Webkit for its browser, but Adobe has removed support for browser plugins, including Java.
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#48You aren't the first company to try grid computing on personal computers, so once people stop talking about how cool the idea of grid computing is or how to protect the web surfers rights, they'll start asking the hard questions. Like, how you're going to make money. How do your paying customers feel about their data being strewn about the Internet? How does your processing interfere with the game that the user is pl…
First, $1500/node-year (or even $200/node-year) comes to a very substantial amount of money for our target customers. These customers use 10000s of nodes and buy high-end computers and pay a ton for network, power, cooling, and support personnel.
My background is in HPC and I've faced and solved these issues many times. We have a multi-pronged approach to using the compute power: 1) We are definitely writing our own apps on top of Plura. It's a great source of compute power and we have lots of ways we want to use it ourselves. 2) We have a short list of very high impact embarrassingly parallel customers that are evaluating Plura. We intend to help our customers absorb the porting cost associated with Plura. 3) We are open to letting students and universities use Plura's excess capacity for free. We've had several nibbles at this already.
That being said, we realize Plura is not for everyone. It is for a subset of the class of embarrassingly parallel applications out there.
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#49Oh well, most Flash stuff already runs my CPU to 100% even when it's clear it shouldn't. (100% CPU to display a static "Game Paused" screen? Give me a break!). --- "After receiving the WU, the user's computer will perform the computation. The game developer can control how much of the user's CPU is devoted to computation by setting the % usage (either statically or dynamically)." How do you accurately control the amo…
As far as the fast versus slow nodes, we normalize everything based on the average computer that completes work each day. So a fast computer may earn 2X or more what a slow computer earns.
Re: Review my startup - Plura Processing: Web Traffic = Grid Computer
#50Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, we tried to do this, but we can't run Plura in Adobe AIR. AIR uses Webkit for its browser, but Adobe has removed support for browser plugins, including Java.
That's too bad, this sounds like a great monetization scheme that's close to painless for the user.