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Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

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Re: Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

#41

Post by bamboozled »

jacobmarble wrote: post #37
analog31 wrote: post #25

Granted a passenger car is not a heavy truck or bus, but living in the upper Midwest, I've learned that snow tires make a huge difference for winter driving. I'd heard the folklore that snow tires are more important than all wheel drive for handling on both snow and ice, and having used them for a few years now, I'm a believer. So called "all season" tires are not snow tires. You can get a complete set of snow tires,…

Can confirm. I’ve owned front wheel and all wheel drive minivans, both with all season and proper snow tires. Snow tires are much more effective than all wheel drive, but having both is (obviously) better.

Was just going to say, just have both?

Re: Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

#43

Post by analog31 »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #30
u801e wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do help even on ice compared to all seasons or summer tires: https://youtu.be/GlYEMH10Z4s?t=39 . Studs definitely are better on ice, but cause issues on dry pavement and may be illegal to use depending on the state and time of year.

I've used all kinds of traction tires in real world conditions over the years and say otherwise. Yes, brand new snow tires are far better than all seasons on ice. But after a few months the soft rubber on them will deteriorate and they're just the same as all season, but now with the added 'benefit' that you have no idea this has happened until you try to brake on ice and it doesnt grip as well anymore. I honestly th…

I appreciate your comment. While I think my snow tires have helped on ice, I'm hesitant to make a broad claim about them without quantitative evidence to back me up. And I certainly take all precautions if there might be ice, ranging from slowing down a lot, to staying home.

Now, I love my carbide studded bicycle tires. Those definitely do work on ice. But once again, staying upright on ice involves a combination of those tires and other precautions such as slowing down.

Re: Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

#44

Post by KennyBlanken »

mannykannot wrote: post #26
scubazealous wrote: post #12

They look like they would improve traction while moving, but when braking I could see the chains slipping out from under the tires letting the vehicle slide. Not fun on icy roads. Seems like a great solution for light snow/mild ice but I would not want to trust my life to these in harsh conditions.

That's a fair question, though I would guess that, unless the wheel is locked, it is no more likely to slip out under braking traction than driving traction. That figure may well be higher than for fitted chains or studded tires. AWD has the characteristic of improving driving traction while doing very little for braking or steering, as demonstrated by the guy who passed us and then rear-ended the mail delivery van.

In a true full-time AWD system when applying any power, there's half the torque which means there's more capacity for the tire to handle side loads from cornering/turning.

However, AWD in vehicles without traction control recovery from a slide is more difficult due to there being two different thrust vectors.

Re: Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

#45

Post by nimbius »

blamazon wrote: post #16

These have been common in North America for large trucks operating in snowy places for decades - school buses, dump trucks, etc. Handy because you don't have to stop/get out/interrupt service - just flip a switch and you've got improved traction!

as a large truck mechanic i can say theyre okay and degrade roads casually because operators suck at learning how to use them.. in real winters like Alberta the drivewheel is either frozen to the motorized arm all the time, or glides like a ballerina against a wall of ice from the tire. this is a solution for a problem of casual issue, like climate change in the south usa perhaps :)

Re: Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

#47

Post by nkurz »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #30
u801e wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do help even on ice compared to all seasons or summer tires: https://youtu.be/GlYEMH10Z4s?t=39 . Studs definitely are better on ice, but cause issues on dry pavement and may be illegal to use depending on the state and time of year.

I've used all kinds of traction tires in real world conditions over the years and say otherwise. Yes, brand new snow tires are far better than all seasons on ice. But after a few months the soft rubber on them will deteriorate and they're just the same as all season, but now with the added 'benefit' that you have no idea this has happened until you try to brake on ice and it doesnt grip as well anymore. I honestly th…

Expanding on your excellent answer, the real difference between studded and unstudded winter tires isn't just how the perform on ice, but on ice as the temperature approaches freezing. At very cold temps, the unstudded actually have an advantage. The ice is too hard for the studs to penetrate, and the softer rubber of the studless stops a bit shorter.

But as the temperature warms to freezing and the ice gets softer, the studs really come into their own. The studded tires have an even shorter stopping distance than they did at 0F/-20C, but the unstudded start sliding and almost never stop. In the worst case, the stopping distance can be almost 3x longer than the studded!

Here's an accurate (although biased) summary of a Russian study about this: http://www.skstuds.ca/2015/10/04/the-studless-tire-deception.... Clicking through to the Google translate of the original gives even more info.

I live in Vermont, and use studless winter tires for the winter months. On snow they are great. On cold clear roads, they are much better than All Seasons. But if you hit black ice on a thawing road, you need to know that they will not stop you the way a studded tire would.

Re: Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

#48

Post by divbzero »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #30
u801e wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do help even on ice compared to all seasons or summer tires: https://youtu.be/GlYEMH10Z4s?t=39 . Studs definitely are better on ice, but cause issues on dry pavement and may be illegal to use depending on the state and time of year.

I've used all kinds of traction tires in real world conditions over the years and say otherwise. Yes, brand new snow tires are far better than all seasons on ice. But after a few months the soft rubber on them will deteriorate and they're just the same as all season, but now with the added 'benefit' that you have no idea this has happened until you try to brake on ice and it doesnt grip as well anymore. I honestly th…

This fits my personal experience. I don’t think I have ever slipped in snow when using snow tires. In fact, I have seen big all-wheel drives slip and slide in all season tires while my small front-wheel drive maneuvered just fine in snow tires. Driving in ice, on the other hand, feels just about as slick with or without snow tires.

Re: Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

#49

Post by danw1979 »

analog31 wrote: post #43
qbasic_forever wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've used all kinds of traction tires in real world conditions over the years and say otherwise. Yes, brand new snow tires are far better than all seasons on ice. But after a few months the soft rubber on them will deteriorate and they're just the same as all season, but now with the added 'benefit' that you have no idea this has happened until you try to brake on ice and it doesnt grip as well anymore. I honestly th…

I appreciate your comment. While I think my snow tires have helped on ice, I'm hesitant to make a broad claim about them without quantitative evidence to back me up. And I certainly take all precautions if there might be ice, ranging from slowing down a lot, to staying home. Now, I love my carbide studded bicycle tires. Those definitely do work on ice. But once again, staying upright on ice involves a combination of…

Studded bicycle tyres work great on wet leaves too.

Re: Automatic snow tires throw chains at your wheels [video]

#50

Post by Evidlo »

tmoertel wrote: post #4
exabrial wrote: post #2

Freaking cool, but maybe a slight projectile hazard?

Related question: If the alignment of the rotating discs goes out, can these chains turn into undercarriage destroyers?

You'd probably hear the rattling and stop driving
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