Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

justice.gov

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 487 posts

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#41

Post by duskwuff »

grecy wrote: post #30

I feel like this is exactly like going after ivory poachers instead of the buyers at the other end. Who is creating a market for stolen catalytic converters? Are the precious metals being extracted, melted down and sold? to who and where? Put THOSE people in jail for the rest of their lives and change the setup so there is in incentive for anyone to even steal one in the first place.

From the press release:

> They knowingly purchased stolen catalytic converters and, through a “de-canning” process, extracted the precious metal powders from the catalytic core. DG Auto sold the precious metal powders it processed from California and elsewhere to a metal refinery for over $545 million.

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#42

Post by sergiotapia »

grecy wrote: post #30

I feel like this is exactly like going after ivory poachers instead of the buyers at the other end. Who is creating a market for stolen catalytic converters? Are the precious metals being extracted, melted down and sold? to who and where? Put THOSE people in jail for the rest of their lives and change the setup so there is in incentive for anyone to even steal one in the first place.

"You follow drugs, you get drug addicts and drug dealers. But you start to follow the money, and you don't know where the fuck it's gonna take you."

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#43

Post by intimidated »

aaomidi wrote: post #16
treeman79 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only thing that will help is serious prison sentences and the right to defend property with deadly force. Many areas of the country there is no consequences.

You know how if you punish a dog, it doesn't really learn and get better? Humans are like that too. Theft is heavily correlated with the economy. Arguably it's a canary in the mine - you can very usually tell what's going to happen in the macroeconomics of an area by just following crime statistics. "Deterrence" has generally been found to be a pretty well-rooted myth. Majority of theft also happens by people who _do…

> "Deterrence" has generally been found to be a pretty well-rooted myth.

I'm interested in learning more. Do you have some good resources you could point me to?

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#44

Post by HarryHirsch »

nkrisc wrote: post #18
treeman79 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only thing that will help is serious prison sentences and the right to defend property with deadly force. Many areas of the country there is no consequences.

Property is not worth a life. Not even the life of the person damaging it. Property can be replaced, a life can not. Besides, there’s way too much margin for error in vigilante justice. That’s why we have trials, imperfect as even they may be. They’re certainly better than empowering everyone to be judge, jury, and executioner because they thought you might be committing a property crime.

Property is not worth a life. Not even the life of the person damaging it.

Have you seen the film "Bicycle Thieves"? If someone's property is his livelihood one can have sympathies for those defending it with extreme measures.

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#45

Post by googlryas »

genmud wrote: post #19
beardog wrote: post #5

>The 21 defendants are charged in two separate indictments that were unsealed today in the Eastern District of California and the Northern District of Oklahoma following extensive law enforcement arrest and search operations. In addition to the indictments, over 32 search warrants were executed, and law enforcement seized millions of dollars in assets, including homes, bank accounts, cash, and luxury vehicles. I obvi…

I think that if you paid for your home with criminal activity you should forfeit that to repay the victims of your crimes. If your legal and illegal stuff is together, tough shit.

I see your point, but imagine a situation where I robbed bank for a million dollars. Should I be able to use that million to pay a really good lawyer to defend me in court? And then after I'm feeling guilty I just throw my hands up and say "well I don't have that million anymore, good luck collecting it from me while I'm in jail."

At the very least, I believe the assets would be returned to them if it turns out they are found not guilty. So they are seized but not gone for good.

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#46

Post by shakezula »

treeman79 wrote: post #6
NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #3

It's kinda fascinating to watch mining for precious metals go from digging tunnels, to extracting from other people's cars. I wonder if this will make a dent in how often it happens. My niece's was stolen in broad daylight.

Only thing that will help is serious prison sentences and the right to defend property with deadly force. Many areas of the country there is no consequences.

I’m a gun-owning full pro-2A believer and I absolutely disagree with killing someone over stealing a catalytic converter. For fuck’s sake, prison or murder cannot be the only two options here.

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#47

Post by TEP_Kim_Il_Sung »

aaomidi wrote: post #16
treeman79 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only thing that will help is serious prison sentences and the right to defend property with deadly force. Many areas of the country there is no consequences.

You know how if you punish a dog, it doesn't really learn and get better? Humans are like that too. Theft is heavily correlated with the economy. Arguably it's a canary in the mine - you can very usually tell what's going to happen in the macroeconomics of an area by just following crime statistics. "Deterrence" has generally been found to be a pretty well-rooted myth. Majority of theft also happens by people who _do…

Great differences of wealth in the same area, coupled with a culture of "keeping up with the Joneses", and policies disabling/disincentivizing stable relationships, are good predictors for violence and theft.

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#48

Post by plantain »

treeman79 wrote: post #6
NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #3

It's kinda fascinating to watch mining for precious metals go from digging tunnels, to extracting from other people's cars. I wonder if this will make a dent in how often it happens. My niece's was stolen in broad daylight.

Only thing that will help is serious prison sentences and the right to defend property with deadly force. Many areas of the country there is no consequences.

Why is catalytic converter theft seemingly worse in the US/UK than in Europe/AU/NZ?

I think the problem is underlying societal collapse rather than consequences.

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#49

Post by ctime »

I’ve armored both of my IC engine vehicles due to the local theft issues which spiked after the pandemic started. Cost about $400 per vehicle (both happen to be the top targets for thieves). I’m hoping it’s saved me the annoyance of having the part stolen, but I’m rather sad to see things degenerate to this level. Glad to see the feds really go after the crooks.

Re: Justice Department announces takedown of catalytic converter theft ring

#50

Post by mortenjorck »

55555 wrote: post #28

I may be misreading this but the margins look insane. DG Auto paid like 38 million USD for stolen converters, performed a simple extraction process, then sold the precious metals for 550 million USD. Wow.

This makes me very curious how many steps in the laundering chain you have to go before it’s no longer indefensibly obvious that something's not right with the sourcing.
Post reply on HN