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Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

ec.europa.eu

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Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#41

Post by rgllm »

newaccount74 wrote: post #4

This will be huge. This will allow anyone to accept digital payments, eg. at a farmers market, using the bank accounts everyone already has. The only thing missing is forcing banks to provide an API for third party integrations, but I think there is a separate proposal on the way for that. Imagine being able to accept instant payments from everyone in the EU, without having to sign up for a service like Stripe or Pay…

Banks in EU are already obligated to provide an API for third party integrations.

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#42

Post by hocuspocus »

prvit wrote: post #33
hocuspocus wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I wire 200k I honestly don't care if it takes a few hours (nowadays, old-school SEPA transfers don't necessarily take more) and happens only during business days/hours. It gives everyone more room to cancel if you fucked up.

If I wire 200k to buy a car, I want that money to arrive instantly. I certainly do not want to spend hours at some parking lot waiting for the money to arrive, I want to sign the papers right there and then and take the car with me. No fucking way I’m gonna leave some random with both the car and my 200k. So instead of sending a bank transfer, I still have to show up with a big bag of cash in 2022 . The amounts where…

> 200k is still well within normal everyday p2p transactions.

You should probably get out of your bubble.

That said, it's a false dichotomy. You can perfectly allow sky-high limits to SCT Inst for customers who regularly need it, yet have more reasonable policies for the 99% of the population who's perfectly OK with a slow transfer when they wire money to a notary public to buy a property.

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#43

Post by hocuspocus »

lou1306 wrote: post #38
hardware2win wrote: post #7

Will it be like Polish BLIK? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blik Instant payments Money transfers over phone number 2 minutes payment codes that you type on e.g website and accept payment in app Shopping example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBw1qa07gGU Stats: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDI4R94ZLvM

Similar systems exist also in France (Paylib) and Sweden (Swish). Swish is embarassignly popular and also accepted in many shops. Making them compatible EU-wide seems like the logical next step.

https://empsa.org

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#44

Post by robin_reala »

lou1306 wrote: post #38
hardware2win wrote: post #7

Will it be like Polish BLIK? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blik Instant payments Money transfers over phone number 2 minutes payment codes that you type on e.g website and accept payment in app Shopping example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBw1qa07gGU Stats: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDI4R94ZLvM

Similar systems exist also in France (Paylib) and Sweden (Swish). Swish is embarassignly popular and also accepted in many shops. Making them compatible EU-wide seems like the logical next step.

There’s already an industry group doing that: EMPSA (European Mobile Payment Systems Association) https://empsa.org/

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#45

Post by DocTomoe »

rieTohgh6 wrote: post #18
akie wrote: post #2

Obviously a good idea that should be implemented immediately.

Are you sure it should implemented immediately? > with an obligation on providers to verify the match between the bank account number (IBAN) and the name of the beneficiary provided by the payer This will break a lot of payment flows, currently that verification is rarely enforced. For example I have saved "power company" as receiver's name, the transfers still work since everything besides IBAN is ignored.

Yours may be an extreme example, but verification may be a hard to solve problem once account holder names become too long or have funky characters in it (as is often the case in the EU). For instance, my electricity provider is the

EnBW Energie Baden-Württemberg AG

Yes, EnBW, the shorthand for the name, is PART of the official name, yes, that is an Umlaut, and yes, the name is too long to fit into the standard account holder field of a SEPA transfer. So I send my electricity money to the "EnBW AG", which always worked, but is technically wrong (and technically, there is no obvious "real" solution, because their letterhead and their prefilled paper slips all use the full name, which - again - uses a too long, incorrectly-alphabeticized variant.

Now, for some extra fun, what about legal forms that have a & (illegal character) in it? Kombine GmbH & Co. KG cannot be addressed, but is a valid name.

And how do you teach an 80 year old grandmother - who up to now keeps filling out paper forms - to do this correctly on a screen the sized half a postcard wide?

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#46

Post by saiya-jin »

themitigating wrote: post #39
qngcdvy wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as the tracking I fear the access control. Made some stupid comment online while being drunk? We take your ability to by transportation passes/plane tickets... IIRC this is already happening in China.

Can you provide an example?

Exactly as parent mentioned - in China, if you mess with Party or they just deem you undesirable for whatever reason ie ethnicity, you can't purchase plane tickets, not even domestic ones. Heck, not even trains so you can't effectively travel within China. No mortgages/loans. Of course it will affect your hiring options badly. I believe it goes way deeper. China is already 1984 for a decade+

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#47

Post by em500 »

CoUHKT57BSe wrote: post #24
newaccount74 wrote: post #4

This will be huge. This will allow anyone to accept digital payments, eg. at a farmers market, using the bank accounts everyone already has. The only thing missing is forcing banks to provide an API for third party integrations, but I think there is a separate proposal on the way for that. Imagine being able to accept instant payments from everyone in the EU, without having to sign up for a service like Stripe or Pay…

Doubt it will be huge, we are constantly being told not to give out our bank details as scammers want them, now you think it'll be great if we just give out our bank details to every stranger we meet at the market. This will be great, for sending/receiving money but is hardly a replacement for card payments.

1. Europeans are not "constantly being told not to give out our bank details". That's an American thing, apparently due to a quirk that allows anyone with a US bank account number to draw money from that account. Euro banks certainly don't work that way. Having a Euro bank account number only allows people to transfer to, not from that account.

2. Why do you believe that an instant payment system requires us to "give out our bank details to every stranger we meet at the market" when numerous countries have already implemented such systems that don't require that?

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#48

Post by bo0tzz »

rieTohgh6 wrote: post #18
akie wrote: post #2

Obviously a good idea that should be implemented immediately.

Are you sure it should implemented immediately? > with an obligation on providers to verify the match between the bank account number (IBAN) and the name of the beneficiary provided by the payer This will break a lot of payment flows, currently that verification is rarely enforced. For example I have saved "power company" as receiver's name, the transfers still work since everything besides IBAN is ignored.

The way my banking app handles that is by displaying a warning: "You entered but this IBAN is associated with the name . Do you want to use that instead?" I think that works pretty well.

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#49

Post by f6v »

prvit wrote: post #32
tluyben2 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Practically this is already the case in many countries; NL to my Revolut or PT accounts is seconds, vice versa too. It works well. But it is not guaranteed. Api would be good; I can imagine visa and mastercard are getting a little bit panicked as this is already trivial and I am using my phone for payments anyway (no idea where my card is) (but still use them of course via NFC).

It’ll be trivial if Apple implements it. Europeans? They’ll figure out a way to require chipTAN and SMS confirmation for POS transactions.

Although not in euro, but Denmark has MobilePay that’s instant.

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#50

Post by f6v »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #17
newaccount74 wrote: post #4

This will be huge. This will allow anyone to accept digital payments, eg. at a farmers market, using the bank accounts everyone already has. The only thing missing is forcing banks to provide an API for third party integrations, but I think there is a separate proposal on the way for that. Imagine being able to accept instant payments from everyone in the EU, without having to sign up for a service like Stripe or Pay…

On the other hand, this is another step towards cashless society, where every transaction is tracked by the government.

I don’t see an issue. The government already knows how much I earn, where I live, etc.
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