Kiwifarms Dropped by Their ISP

Post by insanitybit » Sun, Oct 23, 2022, 4:21 PM UTC

josephcsible wrote: post #7

insanitybit wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't see that argument a lot. I'm glad their ISP dropped them. "Censorship" is a bit of a silly word to me at this point. Is it censorship when your email provider removes spam? When your antivirus removes malware? I mean, spam is speech, malware is code and code is speech. So it is censorship. We just all agree it's a good thing. This is a good thing. edit: Since this keeps coming up, it's not just spam emails/…

Censorship is different from email spam filters and antivirus software because the recipient can choose to bypass the latter for individual emails or files if they want to. And that ability is important, since both have false positives a lot.

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Oct 23, 2022, 4:22 PM UTC

adventured wrote: post #14

insanitybit wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't see that argument a lot. I'm glad their ISP dropped them. "Censorship" is a bit of a silly word to me at this point. Is it censorship when your email provider removes spam? When your antivirus removes malware? I mean, spam is speech, malware is code and code is speech. So it is censorship. We just all agree it's a good thing. This is a good thing. edit: Since this keeps coming up, it's not just spam emails/…

Spam is not speech. You haven't found a gotcha in the argument. Spam is a form of harrassment. If it's an attack, harrassment, violence, an initiation of force, etc. then it isn't speech. Which is why yelling "FIRE!" in a crowded theater is also not speech (despite people also thinking that's another gotcha example to free speech), it's an act of violence or attempted violence. Free speech doesn't exist in the contex…

Post by FeepingCreature » Sun, Oct 23, 2022, 4:23 PM UTC

lbruno wrote: post #39

i'm enjoying the right-leaning comments here -- it's not censorship, it's being censured which highlights a point i like to make: if you wish to defend KF, first you have to justify the concrete speech being carried out on it with examples which you can't post here because it goes against the rules of this place -- which should be a pretty big hint as to why the fruit site got censured

Post by dehrmann » Sun, Oct 23, 2022, 4:23 PM UTC

kdmsk wrote: post #4

josephcsible wrote: post #2

This is why arguments justifying censorship by saying "just host it yourself then" are wrong. Whenever you take over one level in the stack, the next level down will just censor you instead.

Indeed all this ride has been a cold lesson and has thankfully shut down the stupid “host it yourself” argument forever.

Post by orangepurple » Sun, Oct 23, 2022, 4:24 PM UTC

sascha_sl wrote: post #28

orangepurple wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what Kikifarms is/does/has. That said, what do you do if you are asymmetrically attacked by activists? Are you automatically in the wrong?

No, but Cloudflare and several other ISPs will not drop you simply because a large volume of people complains. This doesn't work like Twitter moderation. The quality of these complaints warrants not wanting those people associated with you.