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JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

blog.jetbrains.com

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Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#41

Post by nwatson »

capableweb wrote: post #20
OJFord wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But what does distributed mean in this context? You run the editor across many machines? What does that mean? Yes: > distributed architecture. For more details check out the Fleet product page [link]. > [Fleet product page:] Distributed for flexibility > Fleet’s architecture is designed to support a range of configurations and workflows. You can simply run Fleet just on your machine, or move some of the processes e…

Ok, so I could kind of understand the use case of running the UI on one machine and the backend for the UI on another machine. Lots of complexity for small amount of gain, but somewhat makes sense. But then they say "distributed" so that would mean many backend machines, not just one. What on earth is the backend doing where one instance is not enough for one client? How could one client UI possibly need more than on…

Microservices ... laptop user sets breakpoints on a Django/Python API/web server, a Java financial transaction processor, and a golang outgoing webhook queue server.

Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#42

Post by chrisseaton »

capableweb wrote: post #20
OJFord wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But what does distributed mean in this context? You run the editor across many machines? What does that mean? Yes: > distributed architecture. For more details check out the Fleet product page [link]. > [Fleet product page:] Distributed for flexibility > Fleet’s architecture is designed to support a range of configurations and workflows. You can simply run Fleet just on your machine, or move some of the processes e…

Ok, so I could kind of understand the use case of running the UI on one machine and the backend for the UI on another machine. Lots of complexity for small amount of gain, but somewhat makes sense. But then they say "distributed" so that would mean many backend machines, not just one. What on earth is the backend doing where one instance is not enough for one client? How could one client UI possibly need more than on…

> Lots of complexity for small amount of gain

Being able to develop on a huge beefy cloud instance, with managed background services, possibly with different architectures, from your laptop is huge.

> But then they say "distributed" so that would mean many backend machines, not just one.

‘Distributed’ doesn’t mean ‘many’ - it’s distributed over two.

Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#43

Post by chrisseaton »

pjmlp wrote: post #30
rob74 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main difference between VS Code and the various JetBrains IDEs is that for VS Code, you have to find and install the relevant plugins for your use case yourself, whereas the various JetBrains IDEs tend to work out of the box (while still supporting plugins). That's usually the difference between most free/open source solutions and commercial software: you can do mostly the same with the open source alternative, y…

That is why one has the IT department configuring development images. I remeber there was a blog post from JetBrains where they complain about VSCode taking over InteliJ market, by indirectly asserting they don't understand why VSCode adoption was rising. Surprise surprise, a couple of months later Fleet was announced.

> That is why one has the IT department configuring development images.

Sounds like a nightmare! What do IT know about development to be picking tools?

Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#44

Post by suchar »

monlockandkey wrote: post #19

I just downloaded the Fleet beta from the App toolbox. First impressions is that it is very clean. This is essentially Vscode but with Jetbrains language and refactoring engine. Quick thoughts: - It needs a bit more autocomplete e.g automatically close tags for React components - GUI run configuration - they have made it so it uses a JSON file like Vscode to configure, GUI is quicker and easier (can still click run o…

> - Part of me think that Jetbrains should have created paid extensions for Vscode much like Resharper for Visual Studio

IIRC, JetBrains considers LSP to be too limiting for refactoring and code-insight capabilities that they want to provide (I think they said that when there was discussion about language server for Kotlin). So it's possible that such extension wouldn't be on par with a "real" JetBrains IDE.

Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#45

Post by _fat_santa »

This looks really promising. But by far the biggest moat that Jetbrains is going to have to cross to get into VSCode territory is the plugin ecosystem. Personally I work on React projects so my first thought was: "is there a Prettier[1] plugin?". Looking through the landing page it looks like Plugins are in the works but until that is implemented, it's going to be hard adopting it.

ALSO I just noticed this but can someone (ideally from JetBrains) explain what this line means: "Requires login and periodic connection to JetBrains servers to verify the project" (specifically the last 3 words of that sentence). Quite frankly this line is extremely alarming, are you saying that you're scanning my project to make sure it's not a "professional" project? I'm going to assume this line means that they are checking the IDE and not your source but I won't be using this product until I get an explanation for this. You can find this at the very bottom in the licensing and pricing section.

[1]: https://prettier.io/

Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#47

Post by vbezhenar »

jmondi wrote: post #40
zihotki wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because you do it only once and can use it in any other company you work. It's a highly portable tool for free. What are the chances that your next employer will pay for a JB license?

Honestly, it is basically about a 100% chance that the next employer will pay for JB. I couldn’t imagine an employer refusing to pay $120/yr for a JB license for an employee they are already paying $180,000/yr.

My employee does not pay for JB license, I'm doing that myself and my colleagues are either using community editions or vscode (or cracked ones). He does not pay me $180,000/yr either, LoL, more like $30,000/yr.

Also I think that it's more like $600/yr for companies.

Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#48

Post by mgkimsal »

Mostly OT, I know, but... anyone have any clue as to when 'spaces' might actually be a supported task server for their IDE products? They offer 'spaces' as a project tool - keep track of issues/bugs, planning, communication, etc. But you can't connect your IDE to it the same way it can connect to Jira, Github, Trello, Gitlab, Redline, Pivotal and others. It seemed like a short-term oversight at the start, but after... 2 years(?) ... it seems like a vote of no-confidence in their own product. I was excited to use spaces but... some of the most basic stuff I wanted to use wasn't there, and still isn't.

https://intellij-support.jetbrains.com/hc/en-us/community/po...

Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#49

Post by jasode »

capableweb wrote: post #6

> Fleet is our new distributed polyglot editor and IDE. Ok, polygot makes sense, it supports more than just one language. But what does distributed mean in this context? You run the editor across many machines? What does that mean? Coming from a backend perspective, it quite doesn't make much sense. Thinking about it from a client-side perspective, I'm guessing they mean the architecture is decoupled, meaning basical…

>But what does distributed mean in this context?

The older Jetbrains IDEA IDE is a monolithic local application. E.g. it does both UI navigation _and_ batch processing work like source code indexing.

Fleet is re-architected to be "distributed" aka "client/server" style into a "lightweight" frontend + "heavyweight" backend. E.g., the frontend does UI navigation and basic syntax parsing but the backend (which can be on remote servers) can do full codebase indexing. As a bonus, the code index database can be shared by many frontends.

Code indexing for huge repos (e.g. 1 million LOC) takes a very long time and is one of the complaints of classical IDEA IDE performance being sluggish.

Take the "code indexing" example and extend it to other "heavy" backend batch processes like linting, testing, etc. The backend can also be in the cloud.

As a footnote, Fleet is also a competitive response to MS VSCode by having collaborative features. But my comment mostly answers the "distributed" aspect.

Related articles that also have the client+server diagram:

https://www.infoworld.com/article/3664112/jetbrains-fleet-th...

https://blog.jetbrains.com/fleet/2022/01/fleet-below-deck-pa...

>frontend + backend is not distributed, but it definitely is client/server architecture

EDIT to clarify: the "distributed" is describing "distributed application" of client+server ... like 1st sentence of wikipedia : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Client%E2%80%93server_model

Re: JetBrains invites developers to join the Fleet Public Preview Program

#50

Post by yrgulation »

pjmlp wrote: post #26

JetBrains trying to fight back Visual Studio Code taking over their market share.

Basically microsoft is trying to crush ide makers. To achieve that its leveraging unpaid work. I dont know how someone can celebrate tools such as VSCode that despite being free are clearly products made by a corporation so large that it can crush legitimate businesses. Its not jetbrains trying to fight back vscode. Its jetbrains fighting back microsoft by providing not just good tools but also pay to those that want to build such good tools.
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