Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Flanderization

en.wikipedia.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 137 posts

Re: Flanderization

#41

Post by Bakary »

shanusmagnus wrote: post #32

This is one of those moments that makes me fall in love with the internet all over again. I've thought about this idea (without knowing there was a term for it!) wrt aging in real life. So many people seem to become increasingly caricature as they get older. The guy who likes woodworking and European travel becomes the embodiment of woodworking and European travel. It's all he talks about. His kids roll their eyes at…

As you age, the rewards you get from social conformity become less and less important because your social role starts to be squeezed in general. Pop culture stops catering to you as much, you are less likely to multiply intimate partners or discover new friends or change your circle to a great extent, though obviously this is a vague trend and there are tons of exceptions to this.

From your own perspective, you have less of an interest in pursuing entirely new projects because the horizon of good experiences from those gets shorter, and as you have said you also gravitate more experience towards the things you have pursued, which unlocks other experiences on its own.

Orson Scott Card once said that Asimov was one of the few writers who kept improving in old age, because most others would fall into the trap of indulging in their eccentricity and assuming that the image people had of them was already set in stone.

I'd say it's helpful to always keep a slight distance, even from things that become increasingly foundational to your life. True bitterness comes when you cease to believe that new generations are actually capable of enjoying their things the same way you did yours in your youth. As long as you don't lose your capacity for theory of mind or refuse to believe that time goes on, you'll be fine.

Re: Flanderization

#42

Post by Bakary »

nkozyra wrote: post #9
kzrdude wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems very, very sad.

Well, it's a sad part of culture in 2022 - an enormous abandonment of creativity or authenticity for clicks. Even sadder that it works.

Authentic people exist and always will; you just have to work to find them and support them.

If all you see are the click-optimized, by definition you are looking in the clicking arena where they will be the most present.

Re: Flanderization

#43

Post by AlbertCory »

I liked this a lot.

As someone who's writing a series of increasingly-fictional books (see https://www.albertcory.io), I can see how easy it would be to flanderize the characters. Fortunately, I haven't had too much reader feedback about them, but I can imagine that if a whole lot of people said "Oh, I love Janet, she's so !" I'd be SO tempted to make sure that appeared every time she did. Give the people what they want.

At the same time, you know that if Janet ever displays you'll get complaints that "Janet wouldn't do that." It's gotta be tough for a TV writer.

In the end, she has to make sense to you the writer, and if you have readers who only want , well... they'll have to come along with you, or leave.

Re: Flanderization

#44

Post by thematrixturtle »

Bakary wrote: post #41
shanusmagnus wrote: post #32

This is one of those moments that makes me fall in love with the internet all over again. I've thought about this idea (without knowing there was a term for it!) wrt aging in real life. So many people seem to become increasingly caricature as they get older. The guy who likes woodworking and European travel becomes the embodiment of woodworking and European travel. It's all he talks about. His kids roll their eyes at…

As you age, the rewards you get from social conformity become less and less important because your social role starts to be squeezed in general. Pop culture stops catering to you as much, you are less likely to multiply intimate partners or discover new friends or change your circle to a great extent, though obviously this is a vague trend and there are tons of exceptions to this. From your own perspective, you have…

> Orson Scott Card once said that Asimov was one of the few writers who kept improving in old age

I'd like to believe this was true, but much of Asimov's late works, particularly the final "Gaia" sequels to Foundation, were terrible.

The sheer breadth of his output (which went way beyond robot scifi) is impressive though.

Re: Flanderization

#45

Post by matt-attack »

This applies to more than just cartoons. Look at Seinfeld. First 3 seasons, the characters were real, each w/ their own personalties, quirks, etc. By the final season, each character became so extreme, so one-dimentional in it's characterization and personalities it was entirely unwatchable (at the time) for me.

Re: Flanderization

#46

Post by Bakary »

thematrixturtle wrote: post #44
Bakary wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As you age, the rewards you get from social conformity become less and less important because your social role starts to be squeezed in general. Pop culture stops catering to you as much, you are less likely to multiply intimate partners or discover new friends or change your circle to a great extent, though obviously this is a vague trend and there are tons of exceptions to this. From your own perspective, you have…

> Orson Scott Card once said that Asimov was one of the few writers who kept improving in old age I'd like to believe this was true, but much of Asimov's late works, particularly the final "Gaia" sequels to Foundation, were terrible. The sheer breadth of his output (which went way beyond robot scifi) is impressive though.

Sadly, I don't recall the exact words or source, but it was 'improving' in the sense of continually experimenting.

I agree that a lot of late Asimov isn't as great as some of his foundational (heh) works.

Re: Flanderization

#47

Post by PKop »

It's almost like "specialization" or some sort of natural selection process. Characters accentuate specific unique aspects of themselves because otherwise they would have no reason to exist; the show could have anyone stand in to express generic qualities. Their quirks are what at first works with audiences, then writers keep going back to the well. The common aspects get selected out over time. A/B testing taken to it's logical conclusion.

Re: Flanderization

#48

Post by Bakary »

mtlmtlmtlmtl wrote: post #28
motohagiography wrote: post #7

Is Flanderization just synecdoche - where one attribute becomes the reference for the whole, or is it a new co-oridnate on the spectrum of metonymy and simile? The comment about Rick and Morty actively avoiding the flanderizing of their characters seems a bit off, as the whole season 5 finale was the flanderization of Morty, where he (a version of him) self actualizes as blandly malevolent, likely acting on urges tha…

Rick And Morty really took a nosedive for me the last couple seasons. It's always just been a fun-when-high recycling of Star Trek episodes and well-known sci-fi ideas to me, but it always had its own style, clever writing and great acting(especially Sarah Chalke). Lately the writing has felt a lot lazier, and I guess they ran out of good Star Trek episodes(understandable since none have been made for almost 20 years…

I don't think they ran out of sci-fi tropes so much as they ran out on the core idea of the show. They took two established characters (Marty and Doc Brown) and explored/deconstructed the inherent absurdity and great dynamic between those two that was never fully exploited by the original films.

The decline started once they had done what they could with it.

Re: Flanderization

#49

Post by Bakary »

User23 wrote: post #40

A real life example from Computing Science is Edsger Dijkstra. His contributions to the field were extensive, but from talking to people and Google search results he’s now just the minimum spanning tree guy.

In the case of Von Neumann, his contributions are so extensive that he ends up flanderized even though the flanderization in question still pegs him as a multifaceted person

Re: Flanderization

#50

Post by [deleted] »

adamgordonbell wrote: post #5

There is a tendency for this to happen in real life with influencers. Certain aspects resonate with an audience and so they overemphasize them. https://gurwinder.substack.com/p/the-perils-of-audience-capt...

[deleted]
Post reply on HN