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Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

williamcolgan.net

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Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#41

Post by vkou »

MAGZine wrote: post #8
echelon wrote: post #5

Not to veer off topic, but this felt tangential with the mention of thawing peat. I've read some analysis that says global warming will make much more of Russia arable and open up lots of new economic opportunities. China will gain new shipping lanes through the Arctic. Canada will also get more useful land, etc. Obviously it's going to wreak havoc on ecosystems and species diversity and the climates of other nations…

Not well, IMO. Or, at least, "it's complicated." Take for example, the boreal forest, which produces roughly equivalent amounts of oxygen as the Amazon. A large swatch of canada is covered by boreal forest. As the climate warms, the growing season could become elongated. However, there actually isn't any more arable land in Canada without deforesting. Grassland goes right up to the forest, and the forest doesn't stop…

Forests aren't even something we should take into account when it comes to carbon balance, since over years and decades, they are ~net-zero carbon sinks.

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#42

Post by scifibestfi »

edgefield wrote: post #9

As an aside, it’s striking to me that Hacker News has a significant audience of flat earthers. Don’t look up, right? Let’s be clear, human caused climate change is very real. Rigorous science confirms this and CO2 + methane levels are now driving very visible and catastrophic weather all over the world. The only thing left to debate is how quickly the planet will become hostile to human life and whether some scientif…

Saying "human caused climate change" with that level of certainty, catastrophizing, and distain for questioning is as anti-science as believing in flat earth.

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#43

Post by blueflow »

shakezula wrote: post #32
edgefield wrote: post #9

As an aside, it’s striking to me that Hacker News has a significant audience of flat earthers. Don’t look up, right? Let’s be clear, human caused climate change is very real. Rigorous science confirms this and CO2 + methane levels are now driving very visible and catastrophic weather all over the world. The only thing left to debate is how quickly the planet will become hostile to human life and whether some scientif…

I’m consistently surprised by how effective the “scientism” push has been at muddying the waters, and places like HN show it most readily. I have more than several friends who are smart, highly educated individuals, working in tech or tech adjacent jobs, who are absolutely convinced that the scientific community is all blowing this “climate change” out of control and that it’s really a symptom of some deeper problem…

> the planet will become hostile to human life

Example of someone blowing it out of proportion, right in your parent post. The trust issues don't come from nowhere.

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#44

Post by edgefield »

scifibestfi wrote: post #42
edgefield wrote: post #9

As an aside, it’s striking to me that Hacker News has a significant audience of flat earthers. Don’t look up, right? Let’s be clear, human caused climate change is very real. Rigorous science confirms this and CO2 + methane levels are now driving very visible and catastrophic weather all over the world. The only thing left to debate is how quickly the planet will become hostile to human life and whether some scientif…

Saying "human caused climate change" with that level of certainty, catastrophizing, and distain for questioning is as anti-science as believing in flat earth.

No post body was provided.

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#45

Post by edgefield »

blueflow wrote: post #43
shakezula wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m consistently surprised by how effective the “scientism” push has been at muddying the waters, and places like HN show it most readily. I have more than several friends who are smart, highly educated individuals, working in tech or tech adjacent jobs, who are absolutely convinced that the scientific community is all blowing this “climate change” out of control and that it’s really a symptom of some deeper problem…

> the planet will become hostile to human life Example of someone blowing it out of proportion, right in your parent post. The trust issues don't come from nowhere.

Have you seen the news about Pakistan? A third of the country has turned into an ocean. 1,000+ have died. Millions have lost their homes. This sounds pretty hostile to human life. Don’t you think?

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#46

Post by yongjik »

goatlover wrote: post #13
edgefield wrote: post #9

As an aside, it’s striking to me that Hacker News has a significant audience of flat earthers. Don’t look up, right? Let’s be clear, human caused climate change is very real. Rigorous science confirms this and CO2 + methane levels are now driving very visible and catastrophic weather all over the world. The only thing left to debate is how quickly the planet will become hostile to human life and whether some scientif…

It won't become hostile to human life, it will become more challenging for human civilization to deal with the warming. And we don't need magic, we can decarbonize and pursue several strategies for mitigation.

Given how many people reject any decarbonizing plan as political ploy, we might as well need magic to make it work. :/

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#47

Post by blueflow »

edgefield wrote: post #45
blueflow wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the planet will become hostile to human life Example of someone blowing it out of proportion, right in your parent post. The trust issues don't come from nowhere.

Have you seen the news about Pakistan? A third of the country has turned into an ocean. 1,000+ have died. Millions have lost their homes. This sounds pretty hostile to human life. Don’t you think?

What do you expect? That earth is some garden of Eden where nothing bad ever happens? Climate Change is going to make things worse, but it always has been a struggle, and always will be. Remember 2004, when a Earthquake and Tsunami killed a quarter of a million people? Spanish Flu? The Plague?

I don't consider that hostile. Mars is hostile. Or Venus.

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#48

Post by MAGZine »

vkou wrote: post #41
MAGZine wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not well, IMO. Or, at least, "it's complicated." Take for example, the boreal forest, which produces roughly equivalent amounts of oxygen as the Amazon. A large swatch of canada is covered by boreal forest. As the climate warms, the growing season could become elongated. However, there actually isn't any more arable land in Canada without deforesting. Grassland goes right up to the forest, and the forest doesn't stop…

Forests aren't even something we should take into account when it comes to carbon balance, since over years and decades, they are ~net-zero carbon sinks.

That's only partially true. You can cut forests down before they burn and finish the product into something that won't just be burnt. Then people can store the carbon compacted, and in their homes. Or honestly, you could just bury it underground if you wanted.

Trees are biological mechanisms for capturing carbon. We don't need to invent anything new.

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#49

Post by echelon »

MAGZine wrote: post #48
vkou wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forests aren't even something we should take into account when it comes to carbon balance, since over years and decades, they are ~net-zero carbon sinks.

That's only partially true. You can cut forests down before they burn and finish the product into something that won't just be burnt. Then people can store the carbon compacted, and in their homes. Or honestly, you could just bury it underground if you wanted. Trees are biological mechanisms for capturing carbon. We don't need to invent anything new.

Would it be practical to grow entire farms of trees (or something fast growing - bamboo, kudzu, certain crops), harvest them, and bury the results? Repeat over and over at scale to sequester carbon.

You'd need mineral inputs, of course, but maybe you can recoup these.

Re: Melting ice reveals two-million-year old peat

#50

Post by MAGZine »

upsidesinclude wrote: post #29
MAGZine wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not well, IMO. Or, at least, "it's complicated." Take for example, the boreal forest, which produces roughly equivalent amounts of oxygen as the Amazon. A large swatch of canada is covered by boreal forest. As the climate warms, the growing season could become elongated. However, there actually isn't any more arable land in Canada without deforesting. Grassland goes right up to the forest, and the forest doesn't stop…

For everything you described the opposite is also true. Now that we've largely settled on "climate change" instead of all the other catastrophic descriptors which didn't last a decade... There will be places where what you claimed is true and places where the opposite is true, if the climate changes in the way you propose. The benefits to many places will be immense, there is no rigorous science measuring at this poi…

There's a lot of science doing done. It's being paid for people are volunteering.

The IPCC is the largest collaborative effort. They produce reports continuously that researches exactly what we're talking about.

It does not agree with what you're saying. They just finished a report this year, you should read it.

Fwiw, as the earth heats, I don't think you're going to find less desert, only more.

I'm all for kindness, and that starts with caring deeply about climate change because the rich west will weather the storm the best. Countries in Africa have a lot to lose here as wet bulb temps begin killing people.

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