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Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

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Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#41

Post by bombcar »

willyt wrote: post #28
oldjavacoder wrote: post #20

Quoted post unavailable.

A union is just a way to make a multilateral contract negotiation between one huge party and hundreds of thousands of very small parties into a bi-lateral contract negotiation between two equals, it’s a completely rational negotiating tactic in a pure capitalist system and it can only be prevented by restricting basic human rights to freedom of speech, freedom of assembly, freedom of contract and the right to live wi…

The union just makes two huge parties, neither of which the employee has much choice about.

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#42

Post by Anderkent »

yardie wrote: post #23

> By signing a card or filling out an online authorization form, you are authorizing the ALU to speak on your behalf. Yeah, they were great at listening before. Also, where are these unions where the people in it aren't the people it represents. Recently, a school board election ad, "we have to stop the teachers union and start listening to teachers." Well, who the hell is in the teachers union if not teachers?

> Well, who the hell is in the teachers union if not teachers?

well, union higher-ups are basically politicians, they're not usually working in the job by that point

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#43

Post by nxmnxm99 »

photochemsyn wrote: post #10

Realistically an Amazon-wide union is the only way Amazon workers are going to get decent wage increases. If the USA is going to allow manufacturers to outsource the majority of well-paid (~$30/hr avg) manufacturing jobs to Mexico and China, without having any cross-border capital flow penalities (neoliberal globalism in a nutshell), then the major employers like Amazon and Walmart are going to have to double their w…

[flagged]

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#44

Post by kqr »

jstanley wrote: post #29
jimnotgym wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the UK the police are neither allowed to form a union or strike.

How can you ban people from going on strike? The entire point of a strike is that you're not working when you're supposed to be.

How to ban people in general from striking is easy: you just call the cops on them. How to prevent the cops from striking I don't know...

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#45

Post by Varqu »

mantas wrote: post #33
Varqu wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps you should consider that maybe some of those shareholders are your parents whose retirement future depends on those investments?

How much of that money is made by externalising costs to the society? Limiting cross-borders money flow is a very good way to keep social contract intact.

So basically, let's keep buying our average quality cars for more money, than allow free trade & importing better quality vehicles from a country that specializes with it?

For some reason, it was the growth of global trade that coincided with the growth of global GDP & the increase of the life quality of the earth population.

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#46

Post by bombcar »

JWlrCk9PkipFTDq wrote: post #36
tus666 wrote: post #25

Quoted post unavailable.

OK I'll bite - why?

If I were to try to guess, it's that it forces political cooperation on people under threat of not having a job.

Imagine the situation where every single company in your state is a union shop (you have to join the union and pay dues if you work) - and every single union is wildly pro-gun, supporting candidates who want everyone to carry two guns (but they'll compromise to only men and only one if pushed).

So to live and work, your money has to go to support that. If you were anti-gun, you'd probably feel a bit annoyed.

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#47

Post by AdrianB1 »

mantas wrote: post #33
Varqu wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps you should consider that maybe some of those shareholders are your parents whose retirement future depends on those investments?

How much of that money is made by externalising costs to the society? Limiting cross-borders money flow is a very good way to keep social contract intact.

Globalism is coming from the same people that also want open borders for immigration. Should borders be open or closed? (European here, I have no stance on that, Amazon has no retail presence in my country and immigration is almost zero here)

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#48

Post by Retric »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #26
photochemsyn wrote: post #10

Realistically an Amazon-wide union is the only way Amazon workers are going to get decent wage increases. If the USA is going to allow manufacturers to outsource the majority of well-paid (~$30/hr avg) manufacturing jobs to Mexico and China, without having any cross-border capital flow penalities (neoliberal globalism in a nutshell), then the major employers like Amazon and Walmart are going to have to double their w…

> Yes, that means less for the executives and shareholders. They may have to sell some of their properties, oh dear. Based on retail business profit margins, it would mean higher prices for customers. Not that that is a bad thing, less consumption would be great.

Competition limits how much they could raise prices, automation and efficiency increases are needed to compete.

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#49

Post by ekianjo »

photochemsyn wrote: post #10

Realistically an Amazon-wide union is the only way Amazon workers are going to get decent wage increases. If the USA is going to allow manufacturers to outsource the majority of well-paid (~$30/hr avg) manufacturing jobs to Mexico and China, without having any cross-border capital flow penalities (neoliberal globalism in a nutshell), then the major employers like Amazon and Walmart are going to have to double their w…

> he only way Amazon workers are going to get decent wage increases.

If everyone gets paid tomorrow 100 USD/hour, everything around you will start costing 10x more. Look at Switzerland.

Re: Amazon instructs New York workers “don't sign” union cards

#50

Post by Retric »

nxmnxm99 wrote: post #43
photochemsyn wrote: post #10

Realistically an Amazon-wide union is the only way Amazon workers are going to get decent wage increases. If the USA is going to allow manufacturers to outsource the majority of well-paid (~$30/hr avg) manufacturing jobs to Mexico and China, without having any cross-border capital flow penalities (neoliberal globalism in a nutshell), then the major employers like Amazon and Walmart are going to have to double their w…

[flagged]

Competition means higher prices aren’t an easy fix.
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