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Vim 9.0

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Re: Vim 9.0

#41

Post by nobleach »

the_duke wrote: post #3

I'm curious how many users are now using vim versus neovim. I switched a few years ago,and ever since Lua plugin support the Neovim ecosystem is thriving.

I stuck with Vim for a long time. I had friends that made the jump and honestly, around version 0.4.3, it still didn't seem to offer anything I cared about. So I stuck with my decade old .vimrc. I had started to get into CoC stuff, and NeoVim was just starting to release their native LSP integration. On a whim, I decided to give it a shot. I ended up sticking with it. Now there'd have to be a heck of a good reason for me to go back. I never enjoyed VimL. Any of the personal plugins I've written, I've had to struggle through writing. While Lua isn't the most amazing language either, I do like it far more. I feel like NeoVim's ecosystem is pushing the boundaries far more than Vim but, isn't that kinda what Vim wanted? They want to remain the conservative slow-moving text-editor. There's nothing wrong with that at all!

Re: Vim 9.0

#42

Post by otikik »

tomtomtom777 wrote: post #39
capableweb wrote: post #20

As Vim9 comes alive, and Neovim community focuses on Lua plugins instead, it seems this release is finally the update that will put a hard branch on the two communities. Up until now, most plugins (except Lua-only ones of course) have worked in both editors, but it doesn't seem like Vim9 will be supported in Neovim, so I guess what people go with now, will decide what you might stick with in the future (unless you're…

Although I am currently tip-toeing on NeoVim, I still feel this is a horrible break-up. Yes, Open Source simply allows you to branch whenever you're unhappy with the original but this comes at a cost for the community. The cost of having two diverging programs to deal with. In this case, the motivation was simply insufficient. Some people wanted vimscript+lua instead of vimscript. They felt the code was too difficult…

It could be also argued that if Vim wanted to keep the community together they could have just deprecated vimscript and adopted Lua.

Of course I am stretching things a little, I know.

I personally think Neovim's reasons for a fork are valid. They wanted some parts, not others, and they were willing to pull the work. So a fork is made. That is all ok. If my memory serves both projects have interchanged patches and improvements in both directions, so everyone has benefitted in some ways. The community (communities) will live on.

Re: Vim 9.0

#43

Post by bluenose69 »

bayindirh wrote: post #12
threatofrain wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No line numbers? @_@

It is already present on the lower right by default. Why lose a column?

I like line numbers because when I'm editing code in a remote meeting, I or someone else can refer to lines by number. The current line is not the only one that matters. I use relative line numbers because I like doing e.g. 9k or whatever. Others on a remote call often refer to other parts of the code with "9 up" or "9 down" (since "9k" and "9j" sound too alike in a noisy call).

Re: Vim 9.0

#44

Post by bayindirh »

necheffa wrote: post #26
bayindirh wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is already present on the lower right by default. Why lose a column?

I mean, I have a 32" 4k monitor for a reason.

I mean, every column counts, even in a 32" 4K display. Also, not all of us have the space to fit these screens everywhere we work.

Re: Vim 9.0

#45

Post by bayindirh »

bluenose69 wrote: post #43
bayindirh wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is already present on the lower right by default. Why lose a column?

I like line numbers because when I'm editing code in a remote meeting, I or someone else can refer to lines by number. The current line is not the only one that matters. I use relative line numbers because I like doing e.g. 9k or whatever. Others on a remote call often refer to other parts of the code with "9 up" or "9 down" (since "9k" and "9j" sound too alike in a noisy call).

You can selectively turn them on as a meeting aid, no?

Re: Vim 9.0

#46

Post by hulitu »

givemeethekeys wrote: post #4

I'm curious: - How deep a rabbit hole do most people go down when setting up their vim / neovim environment? Apart from setting up a preferred color and language specific tab spacing and highlighting, I don't need more, but I've seen some pretty fancy setups. Out of the different plugins, which would you never operate without?

I don't set anything. I use vim as vi.

Re: Vim 9.0

#47

Post by Tyr42 »

tomtomtom777 wrote: post #39
capableweb wrote: post #20

As Vim9 comes alive, and Neovim community focuses on Lua plugins instead, it seems this release is finally the update that will put a hard branch on the two communities. Up until now, most plugins (except Lua-only ones of course) have worked in both editors, but it doesn't seem like Vim9 will be supported in Neovim, so I guess what people go with now, will decide what you might stick with in the future (unless you're…

Although I am currently tip-toeing on NeoVim, I still feel this is a horrible break-up. Yes, Open Source simply allows you to branch whenever you're unhappy with the original but this comes at a cost for the community. The cost of having two diverging programs to deal with. In this case, the motivation was simply insufficient. Some people wanted vimscript+lua instead of vimscript. They felt the code was too difficult…

I mean all Bram had to do was accept the async patches instead of ignoring them.

Then neovim wouldn't have got off the ground.

Once they started building, they wanted to "cut the cruft" and just went from there

Re: Vim 9.0

#48

Post by capableweb »

tomtomtom777 wrote: post #39
capableweb wrote: post #20

As Vim9 comes alive, and Neovim community focuses on Lua plugins instead, it seems this release is finally the update that will put a hard branch on the two communities. Up until now, most plugins (except Lua-only ones of course) have worked in both editors, but it doesn't seem like Vim9 will be supported in Neovim, so I guess what people go with now, will decide what you might stick with in the future (unless you're…

Although I am currently tip-toeing on NeoVim, I still feel this is a horrible break-up. Yes, Open Source simply allows you to branch whenever you're unhappy with the original but this comes at a cost for the community. The cost of having two diverging programs to deal with. In this case, the motivation was simply insufficient. Some people wanted vimscript+lua instead of vimscript. They felt the code was too difficult…

> In this case, the motivation was simply insufficient. Some people wanted vimscript+lua instead of vimscript. They felt the code was too difficult. They wanted to develop on their own.

> Couldn't they not convince Bram Moolenaar of proposed changes

I think (but someone correct me if I'm wrong) it started out with one of the persons who started Neovim, tried to get in a patch adding async support in Vim, but Moolenaar didn't want to merge it, for one or another reason.

That cascaded to a bunch of other reasons over time, like adding Lua support and trying to rely less on Vimscript.

But that's how I remember it being started at least, but I could remember it wrong.

Re: Vim 9.0

#49

Post by Diederich »

bayindirh wrote: post #45
bluenose69 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like line numbers because when I'm editing code in a remote meeting, I or someone else can refer to lines by number. The current line is not the only one that matters. I use relative line numbers because I like doing e.g. 9k or whatever. Others on a remote call often refer to other parts of the code with "9 up" or "9 down" (since "9k" and "9j" sound too alike in a noisy call).

You can selectively turn them on as a meeting aid, no?

Yup that's what I do as needed, which for me is pretty rare.

Re: Vim 9.0

#50

Post by cercatrova »

givemeethekeys wrote: post #4

I'm curious: - How deep a rabbit hole do most people go down when setting up their vim / neovim environment? Apart from setting up a preferred color and language specific tab spacing and highlighting, I don't need more, but I've seen some pretty fancy setups. Out of the different plugins, which would you never operate without?

Out of everything, if I want to use (neo)vim as a serious code editing environment, it has got to be LSP support. To that end, I use coc.vim although of course there are many other LSP plugins.
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