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Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

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Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#41

All this talk about Lithium feels like it's describing a new destructive force in the environment but won't this replace/reduce oil extraction? The Exxon Valdez, Deepwater Horizon oil spill, and I'm sure many other smaller disasters happened due to oil. I would even add in both gulf wars which costs massive amounts of money, resources, and lives wouldn't have happened if the US didn't have a vested interest in oil. A…

Have you ever seen a lithium mine? It’s pretty damn nasty.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#42
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just out of curiousity, how would it get much worse? I wonder if it wouldn't make it better since a lot of the water seems to just be so salty it kills everything. Do you mean it'll just be drier and therefore suck more water out of the local ecosystem?

It is full of toxic materials from agricultural runoff. If it dries out then that will become a gigantic dust cloud that will poison millions of people.

Source?

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#43
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry I just broke out into laughter... you have to fight the FARMERS for it. The people in those cities (with their green lawns, golf courses, cemetaries, and fountains) just get what's left. Maybe they get 10-20% of the Colorado flows?

Plus, for all the noise farmers make, in California agriculture's contribution to the state GDP is fairly trivial, in the low single digits. At the scale this lithium mining operation could work, I imagine they would massively outbid the farmers for the water. Indeed, if we gave up on farming in the area, we could cut an aqueduct from the Sea of Cortez and restore the Salton Sea to a thriving inland riviera. The real…

It may be a small portion of gdp but we need to eat so it’s important…

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#44
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Niche ICE run into a refueling logistical issues. It’s possible to get gas cheaply in large part because there is a vast amount of infrastructure devoted to extracting, refining, and distributing it. Gas prices in 1913 where the equivalent of $9.29/gallon without any special taxes and it gets worse the further back you go. EV’s got to skip that growing pain because they could piggyback on electrical infrastructure.

The existing infrastructure of electricity, excluding building charging stations and the possibility of transmission upgrades, is why I believe in EVs instead of Hydrogen. Wouldn't the cost of building a new Hydrogen setup equivalent to gasoline be insane? You can't retrofit gas stations that easily since the tanks weren't meant to hold a gas. I suppose they could add Hydrogen storage to existing gas stations but you…

Pure H2 is a nightmare. Hydrogen up converted to Ammonia is much easier to handle, comparable to LNG for the cost of management.

For volume shipment between economies, Ammonia is the way to go.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#45
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I managed my lifestyle to need The strongest case they have, is that all of us want the freedom of not being constrained by range, however rarely we use it. Somehow the 45min recharge ruins the experience. I personally think battery swap was a model which got us there but Musk drove the (current) industry to another place, and nobody in the west is seriously offering it, outside of special needs like buses and trucks…

The long haul people should be served by the 100 mile PHEV. the 230 WH/kg should enable the 100 mile PHEV I think, although I haven't done the math on that. I'm in the midwest, and while superchargers will probably take care of my needs (I don't tow), but PHEVs should serve all those people. A 400 mile LFP should be doable for the pickup truck when we hit 260 wh/kg, maybe 500 mile. And if Li-Sulfer or SSB hits, then…

BYD is about to release its ~ $45k AUD car in Australia. 1500 units sold out almost immediately. MG, which is another Chinese manufacturer these days is expected to price-match. Hyundai (the Ioniq) may price match. The BYD has really good range for price (400km NEDC)

https://www.drive.com.au/news/byd-dolphin-electric-city-car-...

If the federal and/or state governments go with some price support, and unit costs to a customer on-road get to $30k, I would think seriously about trading in my Hyundai i30 with 5 years left on its 7 year fixed price maintenance/warranty. I got a powerpoint fitted in the unit "just in case" although with low amps, it would be trickle charge only. The "dolphin" BYD is releasing is comparable size inside to my i30.

Tesla isn't responding to price competition, they see enough demand at their AUD $70k+ pricepoint. They're targetting a different market, one which Volvo, Mercedes, BMW &c occupy with high-end ICE cars (although I am told the build quality on a Tesla is below par, even if the driving experience is good)

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#46
OT but I'm constantly infuriated by media outlets' incapability to properly use units of energy and power and distinguish between them:

"There are eleven commercial geothermal plants at the Salton Sea, producing 400 megawatts of geothermal energy a year."

Is this really so hard? Nobody who took physics in high school able to proof read this otherwise excellent article? None of the chemical engineering/geology professors interviewed for the article able to land a hand there?

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#47
post #46

OT but I'm constantly infuriated by media outlets' incapability to properly use units of energy and power and distinguish between them: "There are eleven commercial geothermal plants at the Salton Sea, producing 400 megawatts of geothermal energy a year." Is this really so hard? Nobody who took physics in high school able to proof read this otherwise excellent article? None of the chemical engineering/geology profess…

I agree. sidenote: Lend. Lend a hand.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#48

All this talk about Lithium feels like it's describing a new destructive force in the environment but won't this replace/reduce oil extraction? The Exxon Valdez, Deepwater Horizon oil spill, and I'm sure many other smaller disasters happened due to oil. I would even add in both gulf wars which costs massive amounts of money, resources, and lives wouldn't have happened if the US didn't have a vested interest in oil. A…

Please add the Ukraine war, Georgia (the country) and even Afghanistan to the list of oil/gas drilling or pipelining related.

Ukraine: https://www.trade.gov/energy-resource-guide-ukraine-oil-and-...

Georgia: https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/the-gr...

Afghanistan (more disputed though) https://www.outlookindia.com/website/story/pipeline-politics...

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#49
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How can they source potable fresh water for lithium extraction Why would they use potable (AKA drinking) water for lithium extraction from the brine? Nothing in the described extraction process involves potable water.

Lithium recovery requires fresh water. Tons of it. Using fresh water for lithium extraction is going to affect ..and take away from our potable water sources needed for the 40 something million CA residents.

This will use little fresh water since the brine (water with dissolved lithium salts) already exists at the Salton Sea. Dry lithium mining like what happens in South America requires fresh water, not this.

Re: Lithium drilling advances at the Salton Sea

#50
post #46

OT but I'm constantly infuriated by media outlets' incapability to properly use units of energy and power and distinguish between them: "There are eleven commercial geothermal plants at the Salton Sea, producing 400 megawatts of geothermal energy a year." Is this really so hard? Nobody who took physics in high school able to proof read this otherwise excellent article? None of the chemical engineering/geology profess…

I asked about this when I was interviewed about my own research.

Journalists generally believe that it is inappropriate, or even unethical, to let "sources" see, let alone edit, an article before publication. Some don't even want the copy leaving the newsroom at all.

I think this is derived from more investigative/adversarial types of reporting. If Mayor Quimby accidentally mentions that "a friend" gave him a new car, you don't want him to edit that out of a story about bribery allegations. However, it's a weird fit for writing where seemingly similar words may have very different meanings.

More here: https://www.poynter.org/reporting-editing/2020/should-journa... I'd note that this seems much more...flexible than the journalists I spoke with.

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