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Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

newyorker.com

41–50 of 411 posts

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#41
post #4

A lot of current news feels very biased, even from sources I previously found unbiased. Fortunately I was recently shared a link to John Mearsheimers 2015 YT video where he very clearly explains what has led to the current situation. In that light I now feel it's a lot easier to filter the news.

You're not losing your mind. You are not out of line either. The media is pushing just 1 primary narrative. Period. We are being used as geopolitical pawns.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#42
post #2

The journalist, Isaac Chotiner, thinks he's a lot smarter and in better command of history than John Mearsheimer. That's really annoying.

I thought it was great because it ended up being a debate about the different positions, rather than simply presenting Mearsheimer’s viewpoint. In the end I disagreed with both of their stances, and I felt much more informed on the potential weakness in the mainstream interpretation of current events.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>This seems too forgiving of Russia and also the US re: Central and South America. He seems to be saying that Russia/the US reaction is probably morally wrong, but completely expected behavior. And the moral aspect isn't worth considering as history has shown that great powers usually act out of strategic interest not moral consideration. Yeah, it'd be great if great power politics ended. Ukraine trying to change to…

"Blame"/"responsibility"/"at fault" all seem like questions with a certain natural moral slant to them. He's putting moral fault onto the US for failing to properly respect the likely immoral acts of Putin? That's ludicrous.

"Many Ukrainians may die in order that NATO expands, but that's a cost we, the United States of America, are prepared to pay."

/sarc

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#44
post #6

As a Lithuanian... All the „It's the West fault“ crowd is missing the elephant in the room. What is the alternative if West did what Russia want? De-facto Iron curtain still up with tens of millions of people living under authoritarian regimes similar to Belarus and, well, Russia. Yes, it's completely „West fault“ since they could have left us for Russia to eat for lunch. More „West faults“ please.

I am all for making Poland and the Baltics a hard red-line front that we protect against Russia. But, taking Ukraine from Russia in this non-neutral manner is just wrong. We can easily hold the Polish and Baltic fronts. And, Russia can live with that too. We can then trade as usual.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#45
People in the US have a hard time having an intelligent discussion about subjects like this because of the "Well it's different when the US does it". John is right about all of this for sure:

> Right, but saying that America will not allow countries in the Western hemisphere, most of them democracies, to decide what kind of foreign policy they have—you can say that’s good or bad, but that is imperialism, right? We’re essentially saying that we have some sort of say over how democratic countries run their business.

> We do have that say, and, in fact, we overthrew democratically elected leaders in the Western hemisphere during the Cold War because we were unhappy with their policies. This is the way great powers behave.

> Of course we did, but I’m wondering if we should be behaving that way. When we’re thinking about foreign policies, should we be thinking about trying to create a world where neither the U.S. nor Russia is behaving that way?

> That’s not the way the world works.

What is unsaid is does the world HAVE to behave this way? Are humans capable of cooperation beyond petty short-sighted resource grabs? If the US ceased it's imperial ambitions, and all discrimination and capitalist exploitation ended, would we be able to build a harmonious society where we cooperate on prosperity?

Up until the COVID pandemic, I would have said yes. In spite of religion, capitalism, communism, genocide, or the entire history of the world, the human capacity for empathy and adaptability is strong enough that we could build a utopia.

I genuinely believed this until I saw 21st century internet-connected individuals politicize the science of virology, immunology, and epidemiology. When I realized people - MANY people - genuinely valued their own discomfort of wearing a mask over the safety and LIVES of others. When I realized that Alan Moore was actually too optimistic during the ending of The Watchmen.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm Canadian. As a Canadian I am fully aware that my country exists strictly at the whim of the US. If we were to decide to form a military alliance with Russia, hosting Russian troops on our soil, Canada would be invaded by the US in a New York minute. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool. It sucks of course but it is what it is. That is all he is saying.

So if that happened... who would you blame? Russia?

The notion of "blame" isn't really useful when you're leading a country, and want to not get invaded. Moral superiority won't repel attacks of enemy troops.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#47

[Removed]

> So America is at fault because they wanted to protect Ukraine from invasion by a foreign power?

Russia has just invaded, where is the US? Certainly not protecting Ukraine.

Pretty clear the US has no desired to protect Ukraine. They certainly could if they wanted to, right now.

What the US and her allies do have is a strong desire to hurt Russia, and they're doing a great job at that since the conflict began. But actually protecting Ukraine? No.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>This seems too forgiving of Russia and also the US re: Central and South America. He seems to be saying that Russia/the US reaction is probably morally wrong, but completely expected behavior. And the moral aspect isn't worth considering as history has shown that great powers usually act out of strategic interest not moral consideration. Yeah, it'd be great if great power politics ended. Ukraine trying to change to…

"Blame"/"responsibility"/"at fault" all seem like questions with a certain natural moral slant to them. He's putting moral fault onto the US for failing to properly respect the likely immoral acts of Putin? That's ludicrous.

[deleted]

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#49
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. He lets Mearsheimer himself get into a knot where he rebrands imperialism into “great power politics”.

Mearsheimer and other geopolitical overthinkers are in a fantasy where small countries should have or have no will of their own and would never choose to reorient to liberal democracy without USA forcing it on them no matter how much more attractive EU is than being a Russian vassal

You mistake saying 'how something is' with approving of it. Pragmatism is an essential part of diplomacy, without it you quickly discover how essential it is. This is no fantasy, this is reality, as frustrating as that may be.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe Russia should just join NATO. This would require Russia to change in a lot of ways from how Putin runs things, but who would that be bad for, really?

> Maybe Russia should just join NATO. Putin asked Bill Clinton about this in 2000; was rebuffed.

Cannot remember the US general defining the purpose of the NATO as below:

"Keeping the US in, the Russia out and the Germany down"

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