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Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

dino.im

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Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#41

Post by nicoco »

larma wrote: post #40
nicoco wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, got this: CMake Error at /opt/homebrew/Cellar/cmake/3.22.2/share/cmake/Modules/FindPackageHandleStandardArgs.cmake:230 (message): Could NOT find Soup (missing: Soup_LIBRARY) Call Stack (most recent call first): /opt/homebrew/Cellar/cmake/3.22.2/share/cmake/Modules/FindPackageHandleStandardArgs.cmake:594 (_FPHSA_FAILURE_MESSAGE) cmake/FindSoup.cmake:29 (find_package_handle_standard_args) cmake/MultiFind.cmake:20…

Check out https://github.com/dino/dino/issues/1193

Oh well, gotta learn google too I guess.

Thanks!

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#42

Post by zaik »

opan wrote: post #31
skyfaller wrote: post #3

Ever since Google Talk stopped supporting Jabber, I quickly ran out of anyone to talk with. I talk with friends on Signal, I talk with FOSS projects on IRC or Matrix, and I occasionally set up ad-hoc video conferences using Jitsi Meet, but I have zero Jabber contacts left. If you use Jabber today, who are you talking to and on what server(s)?

I got into XMPP in just the last few years, after already using Matrix (and still using IRC also). XMPP for me is mostly internet friends. It's quite popular on the fediverse (they also happen to commonly dislike Matrix, although many are on both like me). Lots of people who are into technology and anime, basically. I've noticed most free software projects don't have an XMPP room unless they are literally XMPP projec…

I think XMPP is more popular to use with friends and family rather than public channels. Btw you can join IRC channels from your XMPP client: https://joinjabber.org/tutorials/transports/irc/

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#43

Post by puggsy »

nicoco wrote: post #35
puggsy wrote: post #4

Great! Dino is my XMPP client of choice, it's good to see a new release. My partner and family use https://quicksy.im/ which is an XMPP client that uses their phone number as username, to give it a "convenient as WhatsApp/Signal" feel. I run the mobile UI branch https://github.com/dino/dino/tree/feature/handy on my Pinephone.

Hey! I am considering buying a pinephone but fear I am not enough of a hacker, an XMPP is one of the few things I need in my pocket computer. How hard is it to get Dino working on the pinephone? Do A/V calls work? Any general feedback on the pinephone? Is it your main smartphone?

The master branch as Dino is not suitable for mobile use, since its UI doesn't scale down. The feature/handy branch is needed.

I haven't seen A/V calls working, but I know compatibility is being worked on. Audio calls will work before video calls.

The Pinephone is a breath of fresh air, but it's not yet ready for casual use by techies.

Pinephone is too slow to be my main phone. I'm looking forward to Pinephone Pro, which is fast enough, being able to reliably sleep.

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#44

Post by puggsy »

crowbahr wrote: post #28
bufferoverflow wrote: post #27

The thing about video call apps is - seemingly, no matter how great the internet is on both ends, the video quality is still laggy and blocky. We have 30 Mbps on both ends. That's supposed to be near bluray quality. But that's not what we get. Even when I use the crappy 720p camera, what I get over the internet is much worse. From our testing, Whatsapp is one of the worst. Zoom is in between. Hangouts is usually dece…

I was shocked at how good the quality was in facetiming my in-laws on my wife's ipad. I've been using hangouts, signal, slack and duo for video calls and they were never nearly as crisp and nice as facetime was. I think Discord was similarly good but... Discord just isn't what I'm going to voice call family on... realistically ever.

Apple has more control over its platform and can ensure video acceleration works for all participants.

Conference calls with a central server are particularly suspectible to "lowest common denominator" issues.

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#45

Post by hkt »

xiaomai wrote: post #22
toastercat wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but my kids that are too young for phones join in with Dino Curious about this, since it seems to imply your kids use Linux desktops. How has that worked out?

Honestly, it's been pretty great. In general it's not something we think about much? Internet/chatting with friends/video games all just work (in terms of video games, they're mostly doing minecraft or pico-8 games... we try not to do _too_ much gaming anyway, but anything else they're doing is probably on the nintendo switch). My daughter recently has started to do more artwork on the computer (she's using a Wacom t…

I can second this: my darling offspring has a raspberry pi and thrives on it - he has never used OSX or Windows. Just Android (on a tablet) and Raspbian.

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#46

Post by southerntofu »

bufferoverflow wrote: post #27

The thing about video call apps is - seemingly, no matter how great the internet is on both ends, the video quality is still laggy and blocky. We have 30 Mbps on both ends. That's supposed to be near bluray quality. But that's not what we get. Even when I use the crappy 720p camera, what I get over the internet is much worse. From our testing, Whatsapp is one of the worst. Zoom is in between. Hangouts is usually dece…

There are different considerations: do you have 30Mbit/s upload or download? do you have hardware acceleration available to make a smaller/better encoding? is it actually used by your app? Otherwise, your app may restrict encoding quality settings so that it can run on many more devices (maybe that's configurable).

Also to consider: where does the connection flow through? if you're both going through Google/Amazon servers (SFU, etc), it's quite possible your ISP will provide a route with a decent bandwidth. It's also quite possible if you establish a direct P2P link or through a route your ISP considers less important, they'll slow it down or simply oversubscribe this route.

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#47

Post by southerntofu »

integricho wrote: post #33

What happened with tox.im , are the two products competitors?

Tox is peer-to-peer chat, Dino uses the federated Jabber/XMPP protocol. So on Tox your identifier is your public key, while on jabber you get a user@server address (which is usually the same as your email if your provider supports both protocols). Nowadays people interested in P2P chat mostly use jami.net or briarproject.org, both really cool. Briar in particular uses both a gossip protocol for local conversations (like Secure ScuttleButt protocol) and Tor onion services for internet-wide communications.

Both XMPP and Matrix servers can also be run on your own device (p2p): in XMPP world it's more common for ZeroConf LAN chat (to chat with other peers/servers in the LAN, not internet servers), while Matrix project is spending some efforts on Pinecone based on libp2p/yggdrasil to punch through NAT and (if it succeeds) offer proper P2P internet-wide. They have different trade-offs: XMPP protocol is more lightweight but less consistent about eventual delivery of messages when some servers can be offline at any given moment (it was initially designed as a live message-passing protocol).

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#48

Post by 2Gkashmiri »

is setting up and maintaining an xmpp /jabber server and clients easier/difficult than matrix?

i have been mulling the switch to a selfhosted thing for some time now but i need something that can run on low resources but isnt overly complicated

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#49

Post by ryukafalz »

puggsy wrote: post #43
nicoco wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey! I am considering buying a pinephone but fear I am not enough of a hacker, an XMPP is one of the few things I need in my pocket computer. How hard is it to get Dino working on the pinephone? Do A/V calls work? Any general feedback on the pinephone? Is it your main smartphone?

The master branch as Dino is not suitable for mobile use, since its UI doesn't scale down. The feature/handy branch is needed. I haven't seen A/V calls working, but I know compatibility is being worked on. Audio calls will work before video calls. The Pinephone is a breath of fresh air, but it's not yet ready for casual use by techies. Pinephone is too slow to be my main phone. I'm looking forward to Pinephone Pro, w…

Even aside from speed, the original PinePhone isn't exactly usable if you want to use an XMPP client like this. It gets decent battery life by sleeping, but while it's asleep it'll stop receiving messages via XMPP, which... if that's your primary communication method, is not ideal.

I desperately want to daily drive a Linux phone again, but the current batch just isn't there yet.

Re: Dino 0.3: Video calls and conferences – encrypted and peer-to-peer

#50

Post by solarkraft »

opan wrote: post #32
solarkraft wrote: post #26

I love Dino! I want to tell all my friends to install it on their ... oh. Oh no. They use macOS and Windows. I don't mean to be a downer, but if you want to reach a lot of people with your amazing software (not saying that you have to, but it seems like one of the intentions of the project), it's a good idea to get them where they already are. Side note 1: Vala/GTK could be an amazing app development platform if the…

There are working Windows builds (in another repo, kinda beta still I think), not sure about macOS support. Probably just needs someone interested in working on it.

Are there resources for this? If it's an effort of nothing more than a few hours I'd be interested in having a go at it. I consider it really important for a significant user base (and to generally bring free software to the people and eventually make switching to Linux smoother).
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