Interactive piano reference to major and minor scales

Post by zozbot234 » Sat, Jan 15, 2022, 3:03 AM UTC

klodolph wrote: post #33

yesenadam wrote: post #9

First thing I clicked on was C minor... which showed me "C minor scale". Problem is.. Is that a thing? I've not heard of "the C minor scale". I don't think it's a thing. (Jazz pianist here) In classical piano as a kid I was taught 2 minor scales - melodic (different going up to coming down) and harmonic. Your "minor scale" corresponds to the melodic minor descending, aka Aeolian mode. (i.e. white piano notes from A u…

This is a topic that I think is covered poorly sometimes. It's one of those things that is actually a much longer discussion. Think of it, in increasing complexity, 1. There is a major scale and a minor scale. 2. Actually, there are three minor scales: natural, melodic, and harmonic. 3. Actually, forget about those scales. Think instead more freely about tonality, modal mixtures, secondary dominants, and voice leadin…

Post by klodolph » Sat, Jan 15, 2022, 3:14 AM UTC

yesenadam wrote: post #38

klodolph wrote: post #36

The black keys are in the wrong place! The black keys within a group are supposed to be spaced farther apart, and there should be less space between groups. For example, C# and D#, in the diagram, are too close to each other. C# should be farther left, and D# should be farther right.

Hmm I don't agree. That spacing looks right to me, but, now you mention it, the E,F,B and C notes look quite a bit too wide, I think that's the problem.

Post by fennecfoxen » Sat, Jan 15, 2022, 3:27 AM UTC

yesenadam wrote: post #40

fennecfoxen wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course it's a thing. C major, C natural minor, C melodic minor, C harmonic minor, the whole shebang: all the scales are there for every note, A through G and the sharps/flats. Heck. You could start somewhere in between recognized notes and make a major/minor scale based off that, if you had the right instrument. It's a ratio of frequencies, that's all. That's what all Western music music is based on. Divide the fr…

I think GP was just making a Monk joke, which I appreciated a lot - it made me smile and made up in a moment for all these downvotes! My "shallow dismissal" made some interesting discussion appear, at least. ..But, it seems maybe you meant to reply to me, not the GP.

Post by robbrown451 » Sat, Jan 15, 2022, 3:31 AM UTC

klodolph wrote: post #36

The black keys are in the wrong place! The black keys within a group are supposed to be spaced farther apart, and there should be less space between groups. For example, C# and D#, in the diagram, are too close to each other. C# should be farther left, and D# should be farther right.

  var firstFiveWidth = 3/7; // c-e, 3 white keys
  var lastSevenWidth = 4/7; // f-b, 4 white keys

  // assume each of the 5 is equal width at back
  var cSharpMiddle = firstFiveWidth * (3/10);
  var dSharpMiddle = firstFiveWidth * (7/10);

  // assume each of the 7 is equal width at back
  var fSharpMiddle = firstFiveWidth + lastSevenWidth * (3/14);
  var gSharpMiddle = firstFiveWidth + lastSevenWidth * (7/14);
  var aSharpMiddle = firstFiveWidth + lastSevenWidth * (11/14);

  // average width of what a key in first five and a
  // key in last seven should be (then halve it)
  var halfBlackKeyWidth = (((firstFiveWidth/5) + (lastSevenWidth/7))/2)/2;

  var keys = [
    0,
    cSharpMiddle - halfBlackKeyWidth,
    1/7,
    dSharpMiddle - halfBlackKeyWidth,
    2/7,
    3/7,
    fSharpMiddle - halfBlackKeyWidth,
    4/7,
    gSharpMiddle - halfBlackKeyWidth,
    5/7,
    aSharpMiddle - halfBlackKeyWidth,
    6/7
  ]
  console.log("black key width: " + (halfBlackKeyWidth*2*7))
  console.log(keys.map(function(item){ return item *7}))

  black key width: 0.5857142857142857
  [
   0,
   0.607142857142857,
   1,
   1.807142857142857,
   2,
   3,
   3.564285714285714,
   4,
   4.707142857142857,
   5,
   5.85,
   6
  ]

Post by robbrown451 » Sat, Jan 15, 2022, 4:01 AM UTC

klodolph wrote: post #43

yesenadam wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm I don't agree. That spacing looks right to me, but, now you mention it, the E,F,B and C notes look quite a bit too wide, I think that's the problem.

The spacing of the black keys is so far from the actual spacing on a real keyboard that I question how it could possibly look right to you. I would love to know if you actually have a real physical keyboard on hand, like I do, or if you are just going based on memory.