WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US • Hacker News Board

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#41

Post by asdfsd234234444 » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:11 PM UTC

thehappypm wrote: post #38

ignoramous wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> PayPal and Venmo and the like already make this very easy They make it easy because they abstract away the underlying mechanics. Novi for WhatsApp does the same, but for a much, much larger audience, and does so instantly . While it isn't shackled by the baggage of the financial industry born in an era far removed from the current one, the pace of improvements and deployments can be much faster in face of changing…

Instantly? I’ve come to expect that from Venmo, Zelle, PayPal, etc.

yes, google lightning network.

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#42

Post by MuffinFlavored » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:14 PM UTC

pavlov wrote: post #21

This is fundamentally a centralized system like PayPal. Most transactions never touch crypto. Meta/FB keeps some USDP at hand for those very few users who actually want to do crypto withdrawals. Facebook has been trying to get payments into WhatsApp for a long time. This is just the latest experiment to try to find something that would be acceptable to local regulators while simultaneously extracting some value from…

curious, why USDP and not USDC or any of the other alternatives?

also, why didn’t libra/the likes work out?

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#43

Post by skybrian » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:15 PM UTC

thebean11 wrote: post #34

pavlov wrote: post #21

This is fundamentally a centralized system like PayPal. Most transactions never touch crypto. Meta/FB keeps some USDP at hand for those very few users who actually want to do crypto withdrawals. Facebook has been trying to get payments into WhatsApp for a long time. This is just the latest experiment to try to find something that would be acceptable to local regulators while simultaneously extracting some value from…

Do you have a source for them only keeping "some" at hand? You brought up PayPal, which holds 100% of users crypto through an intermediary (Paxos).

Perhaps "on hand" means "in a hot wallet?"

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#44

Post by exdsq » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:25 PM UTC

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #42

pavlov wrote: post #21

This is fundamentally a centralized system like PayPal. Most transactions never touch crypto. Meta/FB keeps some USDP at hand for those very few users who actually want to do crypto withdrawals. Facebook has been trying to get payments into WhatsApp for a long time. This is just the latest experiment to try to find something that would be acceptable to local regulators while simultaneously extracting some value from…

curious, why USDP and not USDC or any of the other alternatives? also, why didn’t libra/the likes work out?

One issue with Libra was Facebook. FB has the user numbers and money to roll out a potentially successful cryptocurrency that's marketed as a currency. Regulators got scared and it got critiqued/shut down across almost every market.

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#45

Post by reginold » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:26 PM UTC

thebean11 wrote: post #34

pavlov wrote: post #21

This is fundamentally a centralized system like PayPal. Most transactions never touch crypto. Meta/FB keeps some USDP at hand for those very few users who actually want to do crypto withdrawals. Facebook has been trying to get payments into WhatsApp for a long time. This is just the latest experiment to try to find something that would be acceptable to local regulators while simultaneously extracting some value from…

Do you have a source for them only keeping "some" at hand? You brought up PayPal, which holds 100% of users crypto through an intermediary (Paxos).

The Novi site for the Whatsapp partnership says this:

> "When you add money to your Novi account, we convert it to USDP (Pax Dollar), a stable digital currency issued by Paxos Trust Company, a regulated financial institution. USDP is designed to have a stable value relative to the US dollar. So on Novi, 1 USDP is equal to 1 US dollar."

To me that implies it's done on chain...I guess it could just be in their centralized database though.

Curious what the Whatsapp UI does for moments when USPD hits $0.99 like December 1 2021 when it hit $0.989.

Source: https://www.novi.com/WhatsApp

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#46

Post by qqii » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:29 PM UTC

clvx wrote: post #19

Can someone explain what’s the difference between this and when Telegram tried to introduce their coin?

The other major difference is their use of Paxos USD, a stablecoin that's tied to the dollar.

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#47

Post by vmception » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:30 PM UTC

reginold wrote: post #45

thebean11 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a source for them only keeping "some" at hand? You brought up PayPal, which holds 100% of users crypto through an intermediary (Paxos).

The Novi site for the Whatsapp partnership says this: > "When you add money to your Novi account, we convert it to USDP (Pax Dollar), a stable digital currency issued by Paxos Trust Company, a regulated financial institution. USDP is designed to have a stable value relative to the US dollar. So on Novi, 1 USDP is equal to 1 US dollar." To me that implies it's done on chain...I guess it could just be in their centrali…

Protip: this is how Tether works but people in the west dont want to believe that people in the east actually deposit fiat into bitfinex.

Multiple US regulators came to the same conclusion. One regulator said “well you usually create tethers 1:1 in response to deposits the vast majority of times and vast majority of amounts, but for the brief few times you didnt at least put a disclaimer up, also here is a fine for not having the disclaimer up”

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#48

Post by qeternity » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:32 PM UTC

jd115 wrote: post #36

panarky wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because Russia is a mafia state doesn't mean they're behind Facebook's payments initiatives. To make this sound a bit less like mad conspiratorial ravings, could you flesh out how Whatsapp would allow Russian banks, government agencies, companies and oligarchs to move large quantities of money if they're disconnected from SWIFT? For example, how would Russia get around the fact that Whatsapp is only offering thi…

Oh, but this isn't for the Russian people! It's for the so called "oligarchs" and their families who - surprise - don't actually live in Russia! They like America and western Europe much better. And if you don't realise that Russian government / KGB is VERY MUCH behind Facebook and its initiatives, I'm afraid you have quite a bit of catching up to do.

> And if you don't realise that Russian government / KGB is VERY MUCH behind Facebook and its initiatives, I'm afraid you have quite a bit of catching up to do.

Uh, I have to say, this is a new one for me. What's the theory here?

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#49

Post by ignoramous » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:41 PM UTC

thehappypm wrote: post #38

ignoramous wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> PayPal and Venmo and the like already make this very easy They make it easy because they abstract away the underlying mechanics. Novi for WhatsApp does the same, but for a much, much larger audience, and does so instantly . While it isn't shackled by the baggage of the financial industry born in an era far removed from the current one, the pace of improvements and deployments can be much faster in face of changing…

Instantly? I’ve come to expect that from Venmo, Zelle, PayPal, etc.

> Instantly? I’ve come to expect that from Venmo, Zelle, PayPal, etc.

International, fee-less, instant payments? With the amount of ecommerce that happens over WhatsApp and Instagram these days, Meta stands a very good chance with USDP to cut out the middle-men (all of the legacy financial infrastructure) and take the product straight to the consumers. Sure, Meta could partner with PayPal, but Novi is a better, if ambitious, bet.

Re: WhatsApp Launches Instant Cryptocurrency Payments in the US

#50

Post by fragmede » Thu, Dec 09, 2021, 4:42 PM UTC

thehappypm wrote: post #37

The_Colonel wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What makes it so huge in your opinion? Whatsapp has 2 billion users, PayPal and Venmo probably only small fraction of that. On Whatsapp you already have your friends in the list, on PayPal I personally have nobody. It's an additional hurdle, I've never actually sent money to friend/family through PayPal.

Sure, but is this any more interesting than a partnership where WhatsApp lets people PayPal money to other WhatsApp users?

From a individual perspective, if you are in the US and all of your friends are in the US and are able to get PayPal accounts, and you don't personally use WhatsApp and see it as just another messaging service, the practical answer to your question, for you, personally, is no.

However, thinking of this only in terms of this this will affect you is short-sighted, and apes other hot takes that went down in Internet history (HN on DropBox, /. on the iPod). The broader context for this (as discussed in other threads here) is what makes it interesting. Similarly, from a product POV, Twitter doesn't look like much - it's the users that are on there that makes it interesting.