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Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

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Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#41

Post by sofixa »

blub wrote: post #25
laydn wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize, a lot of vaccines are already mandatory all around the world right?

I thought that this is a very unusual step that Austria's taking, so I did some reading... Germany, Austria and Switzerland don't have any mandatory vaccines for the general population. Only in Germany is vaccination against measles mandatory for children and caregivers (daycare, etc). Austria in particular had no mandatory vaccination at all until they announced it now. France and Italy seem to have many mandatory v…

> Only in Germany is vaccination against measles mandatory for children and caregivers (daycare, etc)

Well, aren't the children the (future) general population? If all children have to be vaccinated, all adults are also vaccinated.

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#42

Post by charbonneau2 »

Sounds good. Currently analyzed index case–contact pairs exposed to Delta/B.1.617.2 show that, adjusting for age, ethnicity and index of multiple deprivation (IMD), the R0 increased modestly with genomic pre-alpha (difference of 0·39 [95% credible interval –0·03 to 0·79] in peak log10 viral lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adjusting peak, sed do eiusmod tempotentially explaining its success in infection prevention and control policies internationally.

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#43

Post by lucozade »

guynamedloren wrote: post #21
moroz2137 wrote: post #16

A point a lot of people seem to miss is that there is a huge difference between making a vaccination mandatory, taking full responsibility for any side effects, and forcing people to get vaccinated by depriving them of their basic rights if they don't, but not taking any responsibility for side effects.

Would you mind explaining the difference between how these two scenarios play out, in practice?

In a country with a sensible healthcare system there will likely be no difference. In the US, say, there may well be. For example, if there are health consequences due to taking the vaccine, who pays?

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#44

Post by AshamedCaptain »

sofixa wrote: post #34
AshamedCaptain wrote: post #14

IMHO this is much better than all these "vaccination ID card" that many other countries have been implementing (including mine), which basically A) effectively forces you to vaccinate anyway (unless you want to live like a monk) B) means I have to show what is effectively an ID card everywhere I go (and I really mean everywhere), and the poor employees have to waste time checking it

Regarding A, you can also get a test every few days and use that. Regarding B, it depends on the country, in France nobody besides locations that are age restricted ( bars, sex clubs, etc.) have the right to ask for your ID, and it was explicitly clarified that this doesn't change with the Covid pass.

Regarding A, getting the test every few days is even more problematic, privacy wise and convenience-wise. Plus it's an expense. Not a much better alternative than living like a monk.

Regarding B, yes it is France. The pass itself is asked for in ALL restaurants and a shitton of other establishments, e.g. (large) supermarkets and dept stores , libraries, public transportation, etc. https://www.gouvernement.fr/info-coronavirus/pass-sanitaire#...>

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#45

Post by jmnicolas »

gehatare wrote: post #30
blub wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought that this is a very unusual step that Austria's taking, so I did some reading... Germany, Austria and Switzerland don't have any mandatory vaccines for the general population. Only in Germany is vaccination against measles mandatory for children and caregivers (daycare, etc). Austria in particular had no mandatory vaccination at all until they announced it now. France and Italy seem to have many mandatory v…

Desperate times and all that. With a incident rate of >1000 (and a lot higher in some hotspots), hospitals are at their breaking point right now.

Meh. If it's like in France there's a lot of dramatization: we got an official report about last year: COVID represented 2% of all hospitalizations and 5% of intensive care.

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#46

Post by blub »

DyslexicAtheist wrote: post #29
moroz2137 wrote: post #16

A point a lot of people seem to miss is that there is a huge difference between making a vaccination mandatory, taking full responsibility for any side effects, and forcing people to get vaccinated by depriving them of their basic rights if they don't, but not taking any responsibility for side effects.

unwilling to get vaccinated is at least from a legal perspective not a "basic right" . Austria had compulsory vaccination before (Smallpox). Measles vaccination is mandatory in Germany. The law is that during a pandemic the country is able to impose mandatory vaccinations. see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaccination_policy#Compulsory_...

It's not as clear cut as you say. The German constitutional court has not given its last word on the topic, even though they said in a preliminary decision that sufficient protection against Measles outweighs the right of unvaccinated children to go to school.

Nobody's actually forcing one to get vaccinated against measles in Germany. It's only mandatory for kids which go to daycare, kindergarten or school and their caregivers and teachers. OTOH, going to school is mandatory, so for kids it is pretty much mandatory by extension.

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#47

Post by soco »

gambiting wrote: post #26
forlorn wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe some of them are mandatory for a child after birth (though I question it because anyway doctors should get parent's signature to do it). But how could you force an adult who is totally ok with lockdown? Cut all access to basic necessities? Make police involved? How?

No one is going to be given the vaccine by force. Like you said, as an adult you can choose not to have it, you will just lose access to a lot of things, just like an unvaccinated child isn't accepted into kindergarden. If you don't want to have it then fine, stay locked up at home forever, that's your choice.

Plus pay a fine and maybe do some jail time (probably in solitary as nobody wants to risk contagion in either direction). But all in freedom of course! Okay irony aside, I'm definitely uncomfortable with mandatory vaccines, and I'm also uncomfortable with the amount of sheer stupidity shown by most of antivaccine movement (notable exceptions of course). But when it comes to vote, one has to choose an answer and that answer is only yes/no...

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#48

Post by sofixa »

blub wrote: post #31
jahnu wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have free universal healthcare in Austria. And the state carries responsibility for problems as long as a vaccine has been officially approved. It was possible to get COVID vaccine before approval (off label it's called) but you assume responsibility. Also mandatory vaccines are not new either https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20211029-why-mandatory-va...

For Austria they are completely new... And AFAIK there's no European country which requires all adults to get any vaccine, it's mostly kids and specific professions.

But... If you vaccinate all kids, you've effectively vaccinated all future adults. As of today, most countries in the EU, including Austria, have their populations vaccinated against a bunch of things ( measles, tuberculosis, etc.) by mandates for child vaccination. Just because now it's to be done to adults doesn't change things much IMHO. If Covid stays with us, a vaccine against it will probably be administered to future children as a matter of policy like tuberculosis today.

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#49

Post by _Microft »

charbonneau2 wrote: post #42

Sounds good. Currently analyzed index case–contact pairs exposed to Delta/B.1.617.2 show that, adjusting for age, ethnicity and index of multiple deprivation (IMD), the R0 increased modestly with genomic pre-alpha (difference of 0·39 [95% credible interval –0·03 to 0·79] in peak log10 viral lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adjusting peak, sed do eiusmod tempotentially explaining its success in infection preven…

> Sounds good. Currently analyzed index case–contact pairs exposed to Delta/B.1.617.2 show that, adjusting for age, ethnicity and index of multiple deprivation (IMD), the R0 increased modestly with genomic pre-alpha (difference of 0·39 [95% credible interval –0·03 to 0·79] in peak log10 viral lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adjusting peak, sed do eiusmod tempotentially explaining its success in infection prevention and control policies internationally.

Inserting "Lorem ipsum" into what is made to look like an argument? That's definitely a new low here, even for discussions on Covid related measures.

Re: Austria makes Covid19 vaccination mandatory as of Feb 2022

#50

Post by fcurts »

kavalg wrote: post #17
laydn wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize, a lot of vaccines are already mandatory all around the world right?

Yes, I realize. Not against vaccines in general. I only wanted to know the extent to which the government is going to enforce it as in whether they fine you, put you to jail or vaccinate you forcibly against your will. I heard that the latter is already happening in Australia and personally know a person who fled to the EU for this reason.

You'll pay a hefty fine if you don't get vaccinated (and that fine will eventually be enforced).
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