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Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

megaprocessor.com

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Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#41

Post by mkreis »

temeritatis wrote: post #7

I often wondered i could build some sort of general computing machine if we were pushed back to the dark ages or something. I guess you have to define exactly at what level of technological achievements we were pushed back to. But with the knowledge we have today, and without ICs (or advanced manufacturing facilities) and only "simple electronics" (whatever that would be) if this would be possible. Fun stuff to think…

You can even build a binary machine without electronics, have a look here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z1_(computer)

Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#42

Post by Koshkin »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #35
temeritatis wrote: post #7

I often wondered i could build some sort of general computing machine if we were pushed back to the dark ages or something. I guess you have to define exactly at what level of technological achievements we were pushed back to. But with the knowledge we have today, and without ICs (or advanced manufacturing facilities) and only "simple electronics" (whatever that would be) if this would be possible. Fun stuff to think…

First gen transistor computers often used standard functional units - gates, flip flops, and such - packaged into small modules with edge connectors and wired together with wire wrap on a backplane. Like this DEC PDP-8. http://www.oldcomputers.arcula.co.uk/files/images/pdp8104.jp... It's fairly easy to design a computer like this. Later TTL/CMOS designs replaced the packaged modules with much smaller 74xx/40xx ICs. Y…

A famous example of a modular design is IBM's Solid Logic Technology that was used in their System/360:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Solid_Logic_Technology

Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#43

Post by bashinator »

dhosek wrote: post #38
TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First gen transistor computers often used standard functional units - gates, flip flops, and such - packaged into small modules with edge connectors and wired together with wire wrap on a backplane. Like this DEC PDP-8. http://www.oldcomputers.arcula.co.uk/files/images/pdp8104.jp... It's fairly easy to design a computer like this. Later TTL/CMOS designs replaced the packaged modules with much smaller 74xx/40xx ICs. Y…

We could use vacuum tubes instead of transistors. (I googled this to make sure I wasn't misremembering what I read 40 years ago in an already outdated book at the library and I was suddenly filled with a sense memory of the smell of the interiors of old electric appliances loaded with tubes and dust.)

We could use telegraph relays instead of vacuum tubes - might be better reliability and repairability.

Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#44

Post by magicalhippo »

temeritatis wrote: post #7

I often wondered i could build some sort of general computing machine if we were pushed back to the dark ages or something. I guess you have to define exactly at what level of technological achievements we were pushed back to. But with the knowledge we have today, and without ICs (or advanced manufacturing facilities) and only "simple electronics" (whatever that would be) if this would be possible. Fun stuff to think…

Relay computers are relatively simple to make, and require just electromechanical relays.

Some semi-random examples

https://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~harry/Relay/

https://relaycomputer.co.uk/

Main issue is memory. Takes a lot of space to make any usable about of memory out of relays.

Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#45

Post by HeyLaughingBoy »

bashinator wrote: post #43
dhosek wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We could use vacuum tubes instead of transistors. (I googled this to make sure I wasn't misremembering what I read 40 years ago in an already outdated book at the library and I was suddenly filled with a sense memory of the smell of the interiors of old electric appliances loaded with tubes and dust.)

We could use telegraph relays instead of vacuum tubes - might be better reliability and repairability.

Repairability, yes. Reliability, no.

Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#46

Post by pavlov »

Koshkin wrote: post #42
TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First gen transistor computers often used standard functional units - gates, flip flops, and such - packaged into small modules with edge connectors and wired together with wire wrap on a backplane. Like this DEC PDP-8. http://www.oldcomputers.arcula.co.uk/files/images/pdp8104.jp... It's fairly easy to design a computer like this. Later TTL/CMOS designs replaced the packaged modules with much smaller 74xx/40xx ICs. Y…

A famous example of a modular design is IBM's Solid Logic Technology that was used in their System/360: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Solid_Logic_Technology

These modules seem to be the primary influence on sci-fi movie computer design, starting with HAL in "2001".

When sci-fi writers need to create some plot tension around getting a computer either up and running or down and disarmed, the characters will inevitably be plugging/unplugging colorful modules at some point.

Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#47

Post by Koshkin »

bashinator wrote: post #43
dhosek wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We could use vacuum tubes instead of transistors. (I googled this to make sure I wasn't misremembering what I read 40 years ago in an already outdated book at the library and I was suddenly filled with a sense memory of the smell of the interiors of old electric appliances loaded with tubes and dust.)

We could use telegraph relays instead of vacuum tubes - might be better reliability and repairability.

Except that mechanical contacts are the bane of all things electrical. Vacuum tubes are lightyears ahead of relays in this regard.

Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#49

Post by osamagirl69 »

The mega processor is one of my all-time favorite computers, along with the Magic-1 https://homebrewcpu.com/

The megaprocessor is just absolutely wonderful in how it bridges from 'here is a transistor, it lights an LED' to 'here is a computer, it plays tetris'. I always struggled to unwind the layers of abstraction in a modern computer from atoms in the CPU to running python, but being able to just look at a bunch of literal transistors (with LEDs on each gate!) wired up playing tetris shows how a computer really works in such a profound and awe inspiring fashion.

Magic-1 is sort of the next level higher complexity, where it is made out of very simple TTL (most complicated chip function is the ALU--a circuit I had to build as an EE undergrad out of or- and and- gates) and it hosts a webpage. It currently seems to be down, but you can see it on the wayback machine https://web.archive.org/web/20210815180101/http://www.magic-...

I will never forget when I came across that site and realized that I was interacting with a wirewrapped pile of ram and nor gates over the internet. There was even a time when you could telnet in and play some retro text-based adventure games, To this day, the only time I have played Adventure was on Magic-1.

Re: Megaprocessor – A micro-processor built large (2016)

#50

Post by deltaonefour »

temeritatis wrote: post #7

I often wondered i could build some sort of general computing machine if we were pushed back to the dark ages or something. I guess you have to define exactly at what level of technological achievements we were pushed back to. But with the knowledge we have today, and without ICs (or advanced manufacturing facilities) and only "simple electronics" (whatever that would be) if this would be possible. Fun stuff to think…

The first computing machines used relays which are electromechanical mechanical switches. Current would flow into an electric magnetic and it would magnetize a switch and close a loop thereby switching something "on." By placing these switches together into different configurations you could form equivalent logic gates.

Sometimes insects or moths would get stuck in the relays which would screw up the system. This is the origin of the word "bug."

Prior to incorporating logic into electronics, computing machines were hand cranked or motor cranked gear machines. See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhUfRIeRSZE. The YouTube video literally is a hand cranked portable calculator.

The world you envision has already existed.

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