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Across Kazakhstan by rail

theguardian.com

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Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#41

Post by deanclatworthy »

BelenusMordred wrote: post #23
deanclatworthy wrote: post #21

All the sentimental comments here around travelling by train make me wonder if Europe is just not good at this. I did the interrail about eight years ago and some of the worst nights sleep were had on the cramped bunk cabins. Arguments over air conditioning (too cold low down, too hot up top), people staying up late when you want to sleep, bad hygiene etc. Even the night trains to the north of Finland which are seen…

You can pay a fraction more and get your own compartment if communal sleeping takes it toll.

At least when I was doing the interrail those options were not available with the ticket without paying considerably more. I've taken 2 person cabins here to Lapland (from Helsinki, Finland) and they exhibit the problems in my original comment. And of course, if you're going to go solo in a 2 person cabin then you'll have to cover the cost of the other person.

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#42

Post by seszett »

chadcmulligan wrote: post #12
hardwaregeek wrote: post #10

There's something so beautifully romantic about trains. Perhaps that's why filmmakers love them. I can't help but think of the characters in Days of Heaven, migrating across the Texas Panhandle for work and a new life. Or the wonderful opening scene of Clouds of Sils Maria, with Kristen Stewart ducking and weaving, the barrier between Juliette Binoche and the frenzied celebrity culture of the outside world. Or the sc…

Trains are very comfortable to travel in as well imho. Better than planes, because no airport hassles and the seats are better, and you can move around if the baby next to you is crying; better than buses because a smoother ride; and better than driving yourself because you can relax and read a book.

> better than buses because a smoother ride

It really depends on where you are travelling.

In Canada (or at least Quebec) sure, train was more comfortable than bus in my experience, and I'd expect anything to be more comfortable than the absolutely awful experience I had with Greyhound in the US. Commuter trains in Montreal weren't what I'd call comfortable though, but that's probably the same everywhere.

In France, bus is less comfortable mostly because it's so much slower, but the ride on the highway is smooth (you can't beat TGV but the other trains often ride partially on older, uncomfortable track). And you can't really move in trains if a baby next to you is crying, as seats are reserved (they are on TGV and IC trains but not on TER though). You can always take the risk to go to an empty one but you will probably have to move again next stop (and maybe find yours occupied in turn).

In Vietnam, bus is infinitely more comfortable than rail, on one side you can find cheap enough buses that are very comfortable (both the ride and the on-board amenities) and on the other side the train is definitely not smooth at all. I take the train because I like trains, but there's no question buses are more comfortable (and generally faster as well).

Well-maintained, modern trains on good tracks are comfortable, but they're maybe not as common as you might think.

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#43

Post by BoxOfRain »

chadcmulligan wrote: post #12
hardwaregeek wrote: post #10

There's something so beautifully romantic about trains. Perhaps that's why filmmakers love them. I can't help but think of the characters in Days of Heaven, migrating across the Texas Panhandle for work and a new life. Or the wonderful opening scene of Clouds of Sils Maria, with Kristen Stewart ducking and weaving, the barrier between Juliette Binoche and the frenzied celebrity culture of the outside world. Or the sc…

Trains are very comfortable to travel in as well imho. Better than planes, because no airport hassles and the seats are better, and you can move around if the baby next to you is crying; better than buses because a smoother ride; and better than driving yourself because you can relax and read a book.

>Trains are very comfortable to travel in as well imho.

Depends on the train, for example the British government had a "temporary" solution in the 1980s of putting train wheels on Leyland buses and using them as substitutes for proper trains in the poorer parts of the country. These were about as fast and comfortable as they sound and were only taken out of service for good this year.

Honestly British rail travel in general is about as comfortable as pulling teeth with rusty pliers, it's usually very crowded and unreliable but it's also ruinously expensive to the point you get absurd stories about it being cheaper to get to Scotland via Barcelona or similarly torturous routes by plane than it is to take the train.

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#44

Post by pm215 »

BoxOfRain wrote: post #43
chadcmulligan wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trains are very comfortable to travel in as well imho. Better than planes, because no airport hassles and the seats are better, and you can move around if the baby next to you is crying; better than buses because a smoother ride; and better than driving yourself because you can relax and read a book.

>Trains are very comfortable to travel in as well imho. Depends on the train, for example the British government had a "temporary" solution in the 1980s of putting train wheels on Leyland buses and using them as substitutes for proper trains in the poorer parts of the country. These were about as fast and comfortable as they sound and were only taken out of service for good this year. Honestly British rail travel in…

For UK travel it depends a bit I think - a daily commuter's experience will be a lot different to that of somebody who is making off-peak leisure trips. For the latter my experience is that there's rarely crowding (especially in these pandemic times!) and that advance purchase (fixed to a specific train) tickets are often pretty good value.

(Writing this on a train from Exeter to Dawlish. The sleeper train from London to Penzance is good if you like that kind of thing.)

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#45

Post by ryanlol »

deanclatworthy wrote: post #21

All the sentimental comments here around travelling by train make me wonder if Europe is just not good at this. I did the interrail about eight years ago and some of the worst nights sleep were had on the cramped bunk cabins. Arguments over air conditioning (too cold low down, too hot up top), people staying up late when you want to sleep, bad hygiene etc. Even the night trains to the north of Finland which are seen…

There are ridiculously nice rail travel options in Europe, but they are expensive.

https://www.belmond.com/trains/europe/venice-simplon-orient-...

https://www.belmond.com/trains/europe/scotland/belmond-royal...

https://www.goldeneagleluxurytrains.com/trains/golden-eagle-...

Bonus trans-sib option, technically starts in Europe: https://www.goldeneagleluxurytrains.com/journeys/trans-siber...

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#46

Post by BoxOfRain »

bartread wrote: post #29
deanclatworthy wrote: post #21

All the sentimental comments here around travelling by train make me wonder if Europe is just not good at this. I did the interrail about eight years ago and some of the worst nights sleep were had on the cramped bunk cabins. Arguments over air conditioning (too cold low down, too hot up top), people staying up late when you want to sleep, bad hygiene etc. Even the night trains to the north of Finland which are seen…

> They stop multiple times in the night so you wake to the beeping of the doors opening and closing. Triggered. This is one of my biggest bugbears with early trains into and (particularly) late trains out of London: endless overly loud beeping and automated announcements at every single station. I'd usually like to catch up on an hour's sleep whilst I'm on the train but unless I'm completely exhausted even earplugs d…

>automated announcements at every single station.

The security announcements are the worst offenders for this in my experience, I used to travel by train a lot and the blaring auditory nag every five minutes when you're waiting in a station about reporting anything suspicious combined with the fact many stations are a bit grotty and Brutalist really adds up to an Orwellian experience.

Come to think of it, I'm fairly sure the British government's obsession with three-element slogans started with the trains; "see it, say it, sorted" is massively burned into my brain which I guess is the intention.

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#47

Post by [deleted] »

pm215 wrote: post #44
BoxOfRain wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Trains are very comfortable to travel in as well imho. Depends on the train, for example the British government had a "temporary" solution in the 1980s of putting train wheels on Leyland buses and using them as substitutes for proper trains in the poorer parts of the country. These were about as fast and comfortable as they sound and were only taken out of service for good this year. Honestly British rail travel in…

For UK travel it depends a bit I think - a daily commuter's experience will be a lot different to that of somebody who is making off-peak leisure trips. For the latter my experience is that there's rarely crowding (especially in these pandemic times!) and that advance purchase (fixed to a specific train) tickets are often pretty good value. (Writing this on a train from Exeter to Dawlish. The sleeper train from Londo…

[deleted]

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#48

Post by vbezhenar »

hannob wrote: post #39

I crossed Kazakhstan by rail+bus in 2013, I wrote a few blogposts: https://blog.hboeck.de/plugin/tag/kazakhstan

Thanks for your blog, it's always fascinating to read about my city.

I'd like to comment to "Astana is quite the opposite. Nothing here is old, large parts of Astana were build within the last two decades. Dirt or waste in the streets was almost zero and the traffic seems pretty civilized. Until 1997, Almaty was the capital of Kazakhstan, due to some complicated political compromises, it was moved to Astana and there began the growth of this boom town."

Actually Astana was that average town just 20 years ago. And of course there's plenty of old buildings in Astana. And some areas are outright poor. Here's link to street view of one example, you can move around, and that's the same Astana: https://yandex.kz/maps/-/CCUqnJEh0C

There's "old city" (or "right coast", contrary to "new city"/"left coast") where ordinary buildings are everywhere. It's not poor, it's just usual.

Of course capital status means much more money for everyone, so people generally are more wealthy compared to other cities.

There's no point for tourists to go to other city parts, though.

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#49

Post by anticodon »

Traveled several times across Kazakhstan by rail and my impressions are quite the opposite. You wait to arrive to your destination for days and nothing changes outside the window: just the same scenery with endless sand or steppes with no sign of trees or animals or people. Probably the most boring experience I had in my life.

Funny how western media can't resist poking the dead enemy at every occasion: > Adylet: ‘Anyone who still mourns the Soviet Union today is out of his mind!’

Well, if you'd really talk to people, you'd find out that significant percent of population still mourns the Soviet Union and they have all the reasons to.

Re: Across Kazakhstan by rail

#50

Post by namibj »

rantingdemon wrote: post #35
xioxox wrote: post #33

Kazakhstan is an interesting place. The huge open landscapes are completely different to what I've experienced in Europe. There are seemingly endless rail tracks and telegraph poles. I've been to Baikonur to see a proton rocket launch from there, which is not typical Kazakhstan, but a little bit of Russia in the middle of Kazakhstan. Unfortunately the launch was delayed, but I did get to see the rocket itself. I put…

Great photos! I see there seems to be a stairway to go into the Buran rocket. Can you go inside and have a look?

While not quite the real deal, the aerodynamic test vehicle OK-GLI is at the Technik Museum Speyer in the same-named German City, open to the public (the nearby (30min; car) museum in Sinzheim has a both the french and soviet supersonic passenger planes (Concorde/Tu-144) in it's exhibit).

I can recommend both museums (interests have to match, of course).

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OK-GLI

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