I'm not sure if its good to get in now while the market is hot or wait for January when it'll really take off.
Tech compensation in 2021
41–50 of 631 posts
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#42> Chris can expect to make $300k at a non-FAANG company, but nearly double that if they’re willing to compromise on that “no-FAANG” stance Ok but aren't the expectations for a Staff+ way higher at FAANG than at non-FAANG? Or we assume Chris already got the offer from FAANG for a Staff+ role and so it's just a personal choice? Those articles and discussions about salary always assume everybody is able to work at FAANG…
The expectations might be higher, but you have access to a very high caliber infrastructure and mentors that increases your productivity. So onboarding might be a big leap during the transition period. But I think that explains more of the difference than a skill gap. Lots of great Staff+ SE decide to work at non-FAANG.
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why are these numbers so massively different across the world? Do European companies generate that much less revenue? Or are labor unions in Europe just that much less effective at bargaining? Or is productivity that much lower in Europe? (I'm not sold on any of these)
It's all of that. European tech companies are smaller than US tech companies, have lower gross revenue per employee, make less profit per employee. Taxes are higher in Europe, which disincentivizes risk taking and ambitious individuals. Labor productivity is also lower in Europe. Finally, Europe still has a culture where software engineers, cloud architects/products/managers/etc. are viewed as code monkeys and the pe…
> Taxes are higher in Europe, which disincentivizes risk taking and ambitious individuals.
This seems backwards to me. A society with higher taxes typically has better social safety nets, better infrastructure, less corruption, etc. Higher-tax societies incentivize risk-taking, not the other way around, especially for "ambitious individuals". When there is more structure and support around, more people are able to take a leap.
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah I know a lot of FAANG people getting 500-600K packages. Makes it hard to even think about startups.
Depends on your definition of Startup, late stage companies like Stripe and Databricks are definitely matching/beating these offers. Mid-stage companies like Convoy are also going very high, but there is an upside with those companies. Don't know much about early stage, but a few of my acquaintances are moving from FAANG companies to early stage companies to play the lottery.
I'm a founder taking a significant pay cut and worked at early stage startups before that. Had a few hot new ML startups try to recruit me and their offers are nowhere near what my friends at FAANG are making.
Last time I was looking for work 8 years ago the gap was nowhere near this large.
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#45The actual pay isn't going up. The value of the dollar is dropping very quickly.
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#46Co-Founder of Levels.fyi here. As Jacob points out, the market is extremely hot right now. It feels like salaries are inching up slightly each month. We're working on improving how numbers are updated and working on weighing recent salaries more heavily. Would really encourage everyone to submit their compensation on the site. We also have some relevant discussions with recruiters from FANG type companies on our team…
I haven't been able to get a clear answer for this so hoping you can help – what are companies' appetites for matching existing stock grants for senior hires? Say someone gets a FAANG or "hot startup" offer, but has $800K worth of stock (mainly due to price appreciation) at their current company vesting in the next year, is a direct match out of the question?
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#47> Chris can expect to make $300k at a non-FAANG company, but nearly double that if they’re willing to compromise on that “no-FAANG” stance Is that really a good rule of thumb? FAANG pays double non-FAANG?
The reason the poster arrived at this is that they are valuing stock options as $0. Of course there are non-FAANG companies with liquid stock, but this seems not to enter the calculation. If you were to consider those, you'd find that while FAANG pays well, it's not _that_ much of a premium.
What's certainly true is that stock is a significant piece of the total comp at a FAANG and a startup is unlikely to make up much (if any) of that difference in base salary. For instance base salary for me as an L8 at Google is roughly 1/3 of my total comp.
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#48I wonder how having so many companies moving to remote-work are changing this equation. I've been asking people how much they'd take a pay cut to go for full-remote and most people say 10% is a no-brainer.
Nah! I wouldn't take a pay cut to go remote. In fact, I'd expect the following: 1. Yearly stipend to upgrade my workplace. 2. Quarterly paid trips to meet my teammates either at off-sites or conferences.
The company doesn't need you. Plenty of people will take a paycut to not live in HCOL.
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#49Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's all of that. European tech companies are smaller than US tech companies, have lower gross revenue per employee, make less profit per employee. Taxes are higher in Europe, which disincentivizes risk taking and ambitious individuals. Labor productivity is also lower in Europe. Finally, Europe still has a culture where software engineers, cloud architects/products/managers/etc. are viewed as code monkeys and the pe…
> Taxes are higher in Europe, which disincentivizes risk taking and ambitious individuals. This seems backwards to me. A society with higher taxes typically has better social safety nets, better infrastructure, less corruption, etc. Higher-tax societies incentivize risk-taking, not the other way around, especially for "ambitious individuals". When there is more structure and support around, more people are able to ta…
There are effects in both directions - there’s both less upside due to higher taxes and less downside due to the safety net.
Re: Tech compensation in 2021
#50Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's all of that. European tech companies are smaller than US tech companies, have lower gross revenue per employee, make less profit per employee. Taxes are higher in Europe, which disincentivizes risk taking and ambitious individuals. Labor productivity is also lower in Europe. Finally, Europe still has a culture where software engineers, cloud architects/products/managers/etc. are viewed as code monkeys and the pe…
> Taxes are higher in Europe, which disincentivizes risk taking and ambitious individuals. This seems backwards to me. A society with higher taxes typically has better social safety nets, better infrastructure, less corruption, etc. Higher-tax societies incentivize risk-taking, not the other way around, especially for "ambitious individuals". When there is more structure and support around, more people are able to ta…
It seems to me that risk taking is probably deeply cultural, and is also likely effected by both policy and economic status (collective and individual status). It's probably hard to know how to quantify all of these different effects, but I hope some people are trying to research this!