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An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

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Re: An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

#41

Post by simorley »

chad_oliver wrote: post #40
simorley wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you talking about? Australia hasn't had a recession in decades. Australia has done well with all the resources it stole from the aborigines. Most people living in australia has never experienced an economic downturn. https://au.finance.yahoo.com/news/why-australia-hasnt-had-a-... Australia hasn't had a recession since the early 90s and you are complaining?

While you're absolutely correct that Australia hasn't had a recession in that time, this hides the fact that there have been periods when GDP _per-capita_ has declined. Or to put it another way: Australia's recessions have been hidden by immigration-driven growth. Of course, immigration-driven growth is great! But for people on the ground, what matters is GDP per capita, not total GDP.

> Of course, immigration-driven growth is great! But for people on the ground, what matters is GDP per capita, not total GDP.

If GDP per capita is what you are interested in, you don't want immigration as it increases the "capita" part.

Also, Australia's growth had nothing to do with immigration. It had everything to do with China and China's economic growth.

Re: An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

#42

Post by tw04 »

yunohn wrote: post #28
tw04 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So Russia is colonized? Canada? Brazil? Heck the US for that matter? You act as if the middle east is the only collection of countries beholden to oil exports, and the only countries making what would otherwise be considered short-sighted moves based on those exports.

> is colonized? It’s almost as if you’re being intentionally obtuse. The established term (that I used) is “modern” colonialism - it doesn’t necessarily involve physical colonization, rather systematic external control. Russia has been tussling with the West for a prolonged period now. Regardless, they are the second largest exporter of oil to the USA. (1) Canada is an American, Western country. Not sure why they wou…

>It’s almost as if you’re being intentionally obtuse. The established term (that I used) is “modern” colonialism - it doesn’t necessarily involve physical colonization, rather systematic external control.

I'll ignore the part where you started off by attacking me and point out: I obviously wasn't saying any of the countries you outlined were LITERALLY colonies, so don't imply I did. Thanks.

>Russia has been tussling with the West for a prolonged period now. Regardless, they are the second largest exporter of oil to the USA. (1)

Right... their entire economy is based on "extractive economies".

>Canada is an American, Western country. Not sure why they would fall under my reasoning, which was specifically about non-Western countries. The USA is the one usually leading this oil-hungry warring - it’s even a meme at this point.

Again, their economy is based on "extractive economies" - Canada is entirely beholden to exporting natural resources to western nations, and they are one of the so-called "western" countries you claim this doesn't happen to.

>Brazil has various issues, most stemming from external influences corrupting the local political powers. Oil is just one of them, they are also coerced to deforest their country for European exports. (2)

So.... a western nation subjected to systematic extraction?

Re: An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

#44

Post by rramadass »

yunohn wrote: post #16

Norway is a European country, that no Western gov would colonize or disrupt. This is the primary factor around avoiding “corruption” by oil. Developing countries get baited and coerced into extractive economies that benefit the developed ones - modern colonialism. All this talk around foresight and smarts painfully ignores reality.

You are quite right.

However, we cannot also completely deny that they have had some foresight/smarts (and a large dose of luck) in managing their Oil boom.

Re: An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

#45

Post by rramadass »

simorley wrote: post #37

Does Norway use most of their oil money for social media adverts? There is another self-congratulatory norway article on the frontpage. "Norway to hit 100% electric vehicle sales by early next year" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28777672 There was another one just a few days ago. "Norway bans gas cars in 2025 but trends point toward 100%EV sales as early April" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28629184 The…

You are being uncharitable here.

While there might be a lot of nonsense peddled around, this article does not belong to that category. It is about one man who saw something that others didn't and convinced them to heed his advice to the betterment of the entire Nation.

Re: An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

#46

Post by rramadass »

wintermutestwin wrote: post #18
yunohn wrote: post #16

Norway is a European country, that no Western gov would colonize or disrupt. This is the primary factor around avoiding “corruption” by oil. Developing countries get baited and coerced into extractive economies that benefit the developed ones - modern colonialism. All this talk around foresight and smarts painfully ignores reality.

Compare and contrast US/Brit actions when: a) Norway nationalizes their oil b)Iran nationalizes their oil.

Exactly !

Re: An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

#47

Post by thedmstdmstdmst »

ayngg wrote: post #23
AlexCoventry wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alberta's sovereign wealth fund is worth $18B according to the video, IIRC, whereas Norway's is worth $1.45T.

A big difference is that Norway is a sovereign state and didn't have to deal with federal and inter-provincial politics like Alberta did. I have my doubts about whether or not a federal government that has done something like the National Energy Program would allow a province within their country to hold a sovereign wealth fund worth hundreds of billions, or even over a trillion dollars.

> would allow a province within their country to hold a sovereign wealth fund worth hundreds of billions, or even over a trillion dollars.

This is Alberta we are talking about? If in your hypothetical the Federal Government didn't mess it up the Province would.

Re: An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

#48

Post by AlexCoventry »

bobthepanda wrote: post #26
AlexCoventry wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's meant to convey grief that Australia has allowed itself to be exploited by foreign miners, and waste the wealth that its natural resources could have generated.

hasn't Australia consistently had uninterrupted economic growth? Australia has the highest median household wealth of any country in the world. https://www.statista.com/chart/19651/countries-with-highest-...

But its net debt is something like 40% of GDP, whereas Norway's is something like -110%.

https://knoema.com/atlas/Australia/topics/Economy/Financial-... https://knoema.com/atlas/Norway/topics/Economy/Financial-Sec...

Re: An Iraqi who saved Norway from oil (2009)

#49

Post by frosted-flakes »

codetrotter wrote: post #20
adventured wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada, US, China Three of the six largest oil producers. Norway's lack of suffering from the so called resource curse isn't that special. What's special about Norway is their privilege to control so much oil with such a small population, quite similar to the sheiks of the Middle East (who have often made their people quite wealthy compared to their less oil fortunate neighbors, as in the case of Saudi Arabia, Kuwait…

> still a backwards monarchy that installs a king as head of state Our royal family is there mostly just for show. Lots of us walk past the castle on our constitution day and wave to the king and the rest of his family and they wave back. Over the remainder of the year they hold some speeches, attend some openings and other events. We are a democracy, and the power that is given to our king in the Norwegian constitut…

What you say is also largely true of the British, Canadian, Australian, etc. monarchy.
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