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Not a car battery. > a 13-tonne lithium battery inside a shipping container The other ~99 container battery packs survived.
Oh, so only the 1 would be likely to start a massive bushfire if this happened in summer? That makes me feel better.
According to recent reports[1], Tesla is transitioning to using Iron Phosphate (LFP) Li-ion cells in it's Megapack stationary storage products. Unlike nickel-based cells, LFP is highly resistant to fire and thermal runaway. Presumably, this particular installation was still using nickel-based cells. [1] https://cleantechnica.com/2021/05/11/tesla-transitions-to-lf...
It's been... interesting watching Tesla migrate from their more oddball technical decisions to using the same tech as the rest of the industry. LFP is a really conventional tech for stationary storage as well as vehicle applications with less demanding power-to-weight requirements. They also seem to have mostly switched from the AC motors that inspired their name to permanent magnet brushless motors like the rest of…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Any more likely than a gas/diesel fire? I'd imagine most of the fire risk is at the start, when first responders haven't arrived yet. Once they arrive any wildfire risk is minimal because it can be immediately put out. In that respect there probably isn't a big difference between a gas fire that burns for 1hr and a battery fire that burns for 4 days.
As per article, the CFA wasn't able to put it out, and had to just let it burn. If this was in summer then that would be taking resources away from quickly responding to the hundreds of other callouts they get - I'm not super happy with the idea of volunteers spending their time to babysit a chemical fire from equipment that clearly hasn't been designed for local conditions. You're right most of the risk is at the st…
Wow something from Melbourne comes to the first rank in HN! actually I still can't find any explanation why the fire starts at all. Or maybe they haven't found out yet Edit: I don't get the downvotes, I am from Melbie, nothing is controversial here
I bet people downvote more than they upvote. That would be a cool stat to see next to people's usernames in posts.
So same same thing
According to recent reports[1], Tesla is transitioning to using Iron Phosphate (LFP) Li-ion cells in it's Megapack stationary storage products. Unlike nickel-based cells, LFP is highly resistant to fire and thermal runaway. Presumably, this particular installation was still using nickel-based cells. [1] https://cleantechnica.com/2021/05/11/tesla-transitions-to-lf...
According to recent reports[1], Tesla is transitioning to using Iron Phosphate (LFP) Li-ion cells in it's Megapack stationary storage products. Unlike nickel-based cells, LFP is highly resistant to fire and thermal runaway. Presumably, this particular installation was still using nickel-based cells. [1] https://cleantechnica.com/2021/05/11/tesla-transitions-to-lf...
Who's paying for the transition? The customer or Tesla? Funny this got downvoted. Was this comment controversial in any way?
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28034815 (90 points/80 comments)
According to recent reports[1], Tesla is transitioning to using Iron Phosphate (LFP) Li-ion cells in it's Megapack stationary storage products. Unlike nickel-based cells, LFP is highly resistant to fire and thermal runaway. Presumably, this particular installation was still using nickel-based cells. [1] https://cleantechnica.com/2021/05/11/tesla-transitions-to-lf...
It's been... interesting watching Tesla migrate from their more oddball technical decisions to using the same tech as the rest of the industry. LFP is a really conventional tech for stationary storage as well as vehicle applications with less demanding power-to-weight requirements. They also seem to have mostly switched from the AC motors that inspired their name to permanent magnet brushless motors like the rest of…
Remember that heavy industry isn't like software, you don't get to Just Decide to match the product to the market and switch when it makes sense. You make a bet years in advance on resource contracts and factory capacity, and if the needles don't match you need to find some way to generate revenue from what you actually have, not what you want to produce.
But yes: LiFePO4 has a high internal resistance (which is bad for applications with high current loads) and somewhat poor energy density (bad for mobile applications), but is significantly cheaper at scale due to the elimination of Cobalt and has an absolutely massive cell durability advantage (GREAT for grid storage).
But you won't see phosphate batteries in anything but budget/commuter EVs. They aren't something Tesla is going to bet on for their main production choices, but absolutely something you'd expect to see them optimize as they scale.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Who's paying for the transition? The customer or Tesla? Since nearly all Tesla revenue comes from Tesla customers I would imagine the customers will be ultimately footing the bill. >Was this comment controversial in any way? Honestly it comes off as cynical and a little dumb -- which is why it might be grey. If a business agrees to a cost -- it will be the customers paying for that cost. Your peevish "Who is paying…
Either the customer or the investor. All of the current Tesla capital comes from the investors. They've just started breaking even now, and it can take a while to cover all the past costs. As of the latest 10-Q the accumulated deficit (sum over all past earnings) is -$3.6B. The total capital raised from investors is well over $15B.
They have been more than "start(ing to) break even now". It would be more accurate to say they have been more than breaking even since some time between 2018 and Q1 2020 depending on your measure; capex, opex, financials (interest, depreciation, etc), unexpected charges, etc