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Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

nytimes.com

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Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#41

Post by bluGill »

gruez wrote: post #19
bluGill wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least in the Jewish version the law also said you can't take into account the nearness of the the jubilee to not make a loan. I'm not sure if/how much that was respected though.

>you can't take into account the nearness of the the jubilee to not make a loan What's preventing you from getting a huge loan 1 day before the jubilee?

I read my bible as a Christian, so I know what it says. However I'm not immersed in the culture as it actually played out in practice.

From a reading of the law there seems to be nothing, but I suspect there is something I'm missing. I'm not sure if there is something about who/how you can ask for a loan (thus meaning such a loan couldn't be requested just anytime), or if the culture allowed you to refuse to make big loans then even though the law said you couldn't.

Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#42

Post by hpoe »

keanebean86 wrote: post #29
_fat_santa wrote: post #11

Right now we have around 1.5T in outstanding student debt. If all of this debt were to be cancelled, who would be left holding the bag? What would that do to the economy? IMO if we cancel all student debt, this would seriously rock our economy because we suddenly decided to take 1.5T in debt assets out of the economy.

Would it though? The government paid for my college then wrote down I own them. They want me to give them that money back eventually. Are they using my promise to borrow money somewhere else? Or is it just an expense for a budget year that gets added as income years later? Also how much interest have we paid collectively on that 1.5 trillion? If we've paid that much already then what? Can't we just consider it an inv…

Well it would result in deflation because $1,500,000,000 disappears from the economy overnight. This means that the money supply shrinks and that kicks of a deflationary cycle.

Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#43

Post by deregulateMed »

EvanAnderson wrote: post #32
faitswulff wrote: post #17

Student debt is the epitome of rent-seeking. You can't even discharge it with bankruptcy. Cancel it.

The terms and conditions of the debt obligation are known up-front. If the terms of the loan were onerous the borrowers shouldn't have accepted them and declined the loan. Why is poor financial literacy and wishful thinking about future job prospects on borrowers' parts my problem to be left holding the bag for?

I remember being 18 and being the 1 kid in class saying 'Going away to college and spending 30k/yr on a music degree is a bad idea'

I was right. They didn't listen. I'm bailing them out today.

Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#44

Post by hu3 »

EvanAnderson wrote: post #32
faitswulff wrote: post #17

Student debt is the epitome of rent-seeking. You can't even discharge it with bankruptcy. Cancel it.

The terms and conditions of the debt obligation are known up-front. If the terms of the loan were onerous the borrowers shouldn't have accepted them and declined the loan. Why is poor financial literacy and wishful thinking about future job prospects on borrowers' parts my problem to be left holding the bag for?

As if students have a choice. Don't like the terms? Sorry, no education for you.

Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#45

Post by jvanderbot »

tsjq wrote: post #28
zanethomas wrote: post #23

What about those of us who worked our way through school? Can we get a refund?

you'd get a bigger tax bill.

Not necessarily. I don't think USA has to cut a check to cancel these, I think they just have to stop asking for repayment.

Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#46

Post by willyg123 »

faitswulff wrote: post #27
floor2 wrote: post #13

The terminology of "cancelling" the debt is the most dishonest, twisted abuse of the English language. There is no "cancelling" debt. There's only forcing other people to pay. The incentives here are entirely backwards. All the people who made good decisions around cost-benefit of their education, all the people who made frugal choices, all the people who worked hard for the delayed gratification of their long-term p…

> The terminology of "cancelling" the debt is the most dishonest, twisted abuse of the English language. This kind of hyperbole is, itself, an example of "dishonest, twisted" language. > There is no "cancelling" debt. There's only forcing other people to pay. If I declare a banana to cost $1,000,000 but you can get it for the low price of $1 with a loan of $999,999 today and that loan gets canceled, does that mean so…

> If I declare a banana to cost $1,000,000 but you can get it for the low price of $1 with a loan of $999,999 today and that loan gets canceled, does that mean someone else has to pay me the remaining sum?

In this case you are the merchant (university) and the lender, which is not the case with student debt.

Before you make the case that a student can get a gov't backed loan and attend a state university, the other $999,999 has already been disbursed to banana suppliers, equipment, leases, ect. So yes, someone else would have to pay the remaining sum.

Try again.

Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#47

Post by hpoe »

adamsvystun wrote: post #22
viraptor wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cancelling student debt would pretty much immediately stop new loans. I don't see how another loan for the same amount could be granted afterwards.

I think you are misunderstanding what people mean by "cancelling debt". They don't mean they will force lenders to suffer a loss, they mean that government will cover the debt.

You mean that the taxpayers will cover the debt

Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#49

Post by gruez »

viraptor wrote: post #33
floor2 wrote: post #13

The terminology of "cancelling" the debt is the most dishonest, twisted abuse of the English language. There is no "cancelling" debt. There's only forcing other people to pay. The incentives here are entirely backwards. All the people who made good decisions around cost-benefit of their education, all the people who made frugal choices, all the people who worked hard for the delayed gratification of their long-term p…

The frugal little wouldn't lose anything. They'd gain less, which is not the same. Every single day there are people taking really stupid risks and winning due to luck. Do you feel penalised because you took less risks? If cancelling student debt solves real problems for the population on average, but makes a few idiots multimillionaires by accident... I'm all for it.

>Every single day there are people taking really stupid risks and winning due to luck. Do you feel penalised because you took less risks?

Yes, actually. If people were YOLOing away their savings on DOGE and meme stocks and the government picked up the tab, but the responsible passive investors like me got no assistance because I didn't experience any losses, I'd be pretty mad.

Re: Student Loans. Medical Debt. Criminal Justice Fees. Cancel It All.

#50

Post by thatfrenchguy »

floor2 wrote: post #13

The terminology of "cancelling" the debt is the most dishonest, twisted abuse of the English language. There is no "cancelling" debt. There's only forcing other people to pay. The incentives here are entirely backwards. All the people who made good decisions around cost-benefit of their education, all the people who made frugal choices, all the people who worked hard for the delayed gratification of their long-term p…

> There is no "cancelling" debt. There's only forcing other people to pay.

Not really, given that in the US, the central bank could just take over those public loans, not collect on them, and likely not much would happen. They’ve already proven that during Covid with corporate bonds.

The real issue with cancelling student loans is that it doesn’t fix the tuition cost for the next generation. We need a 20-year tuition freeze.

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