A little off-topic - does anyone know why Steam takes screenshots of VR content played in a headset? I've noticed multiple times that Steam's Screen Capture process ended up hanging with HP Reverb G2 and am wondering why do they need to take screenshots? I'd have expected that from Facebook (privacy lol) but don't understand why Steam bothers with it?
Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
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Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#42Earlier quoted context omitted.
I remember they put out a statement saying it would never require a FB login, and that you were ridiculous to suggest it would ever have ads. Had an oculus rift DK1 at the time - deleted my accounts, unsubscribed from everything, and bought an HTC vive shortly after it came out. Wasn't buying that at the time, and I feel vindicated now.
I don't think they ever put out a formal statement (I'd love to be corrected on this). What I do remember is Palmer Luckey saying that, but then, it's really on the Oculus community to have believed the words of a 22 year old about to make millions.
Facebook kept the promise(in airbquotes) though. Whoever behind Palmer’s Reddit account said he _personally_ assure that _Rift_ remains usable forever without an account, IIRC.
Facebook killed Rift few years later.
Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
Aren't Oculus games typically $20-50? The price points for games always seemed very high to me. In an ideal world they'd offer a "no ads, full price" version and a "discount with ads" version. My guess is we'll probably just be left with "full price with ads" as the only option.
What would you consider a fair price for a game? Are you talking about games in general or just games on Oculus?
I’m definitely a minority in this regard, but I completely support increasing the price of games across the board. Development is more expensive & involves more people now. The cost of games has been $60 for what, 15 years? One additional problem is that everybody wants to cash in on subscriptions and micro transactions for continuous money, even when you’ve already paid “full” price.
Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#44Is it just me? I would rather just pay for stuff and be done with it rather than have my attention and sensorium sold to the highest bidder.
It’s not just you, but you are a tiny minority. You’ve expressed a sentiment that’s very popular on HN, but not among the general population. Take YouTube - a popular ad supported service with a premium tier. How many people are willing to pay to remove ads? Less than 1%. Even on HN I don’t think that number would be more than 10%.
I’m getting close to paying, YouTube has figured out some clever way to keep AdGuard on iOS from properly blocking ads and it’s super annoying. But I mean when it’s trivial for a technical user to download a few adblockers why pay, right?
Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#45Oculus cannot be used without a Facebook account. Facebook is an advertising company. It's simple: if you don't want ads, delete your Facebook account, and don't ever buy Oculus. I got an HTC Vive Pro 2 three days ago, and it's sweet. No Facebook required.
Why Vive and not Index? I believe the Vive lineup is carrying over the same basic design since original Vive and rather ancient for what it costs.
Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#46I despise ads in all forms, and the absolute worst offenders are ads built into a platform just like this. Windows 10 shouldn’t be advertising on my desktop, PlayStation/Xbox shouldn’t be advertising on my dashboard, cars shouldn’t be advertising on the controls/display, and Facebook shouldn’t be advertising in my virtual reality headset.
FWIW, the ads are not on the platform level, but inside individual games and apps. For now. (I also despise ads)
That's worse...
Can't even use escapist reality to escape from ads now.
Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#47I despise ads in all forms, and the absolute worst offenders are ads built into a platform just like this. Windows 10 shouldn’t be advertising on my desktop, PlayStation/Xbox shouldn’t be advertising on my dashboard, cars shouldn’t be advertising on the controls/display, and Facebook shouldn’t be advertising in my virtual reality headset.
FWIW, the ads are not on the platform level, but inside individual games and apps. For now. (I also despise ads)
> but inside individual games and apps.
IMO that's worse. You spend more time in game than on the menu screen. Sadly this is likely a pandoras box we will not be able to close.
Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#48Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I worry about a future where VR is monopolized by Facebook and held there by network effect That's why it's awesome that Valve is so heavily invested in VR to counter that. They might not have more money than Facebook, but they have more than enough to compete with them. Plus, they have the expertise in video games that Facebook doesn't. It's just a shame that Valve is by all accounts a highly dysfunctional company…
The problem any competitor will have fighting FB is entry price -- FB is the only player right now that sells a standalone unit and that unit is one of the cheapest, if not the cheapest, headset on the market with a $300 MSRP. Everyone else is far more expensive and requires a PC with a discrete GPU (or game console, in the case of the PlayStation VR), so the total cost of entry ends up being far higher. What Valve i…
> The problem any competitor will have fighting FB is entry price
I don't think that's true. The main problem right now is that VR is still (even after all these years) an unproven/experimental consumer product.
It's like buying a game console in the 70s-80s compared to buying one today. Back then, video games were still largely experimental and you were more likely to get garbage than gold. Today, designers know what works/doesn't work, and consumers can be confident in their purchases.
VR is not like that yet. A "VR Game" is still a vague and uncertain term, and consumers can't have confidence in it yet. There are some great VR experiences out there, but there are many many more garbage ones.
I think that a company focusing on finding a good fit for VR is going to be better off long-term than one just trying to corner this early market.
Example: If Valve figures out the "secret sauce" for VR games (much like Nintendo did in the early console wars), it's not going to matter how cheap Facebook's headsets are. People (including Oculus owners) will flock to Steam for the superior experiences while Facebook scrambles to make clones. With a failed "platform", Facebook will ultimately lose.
If anything, Facebook's investments to flood the market with cheap headsets (possibly even subsidizing them) could end up helping Valve in the long term, since it just means more potential Steam customers, and it gives Valve the opportunity to experiment with the high-end stuff without worrying about the market completely dying in the meantime.
Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#49Oculus cannot be used without a Facebook account. Facebook is an advertising company. It's simple: if you don't want ads, delete your Facebook account, and don't ever buy Oculus. I got an HTC Vive Pro 2 three days ago, and it's sweet. No Facebook required.
The Vive Pro 2 is absurdly expensive ($1400) compared to the Oculus offering. The Vive Pros are at its name implies, for pros, or for people with big budgets who want the best. You simply can't compare. I think that if you don't want to buy Oculus and have a reasonable budget (~$400), WMR headsets are the only alternative.
That's like saying you can't compare a top of the line MacBook to a $300 HP laptop. The Pro 2 hardware specs are significantly better than the Oculus and the price isn't being subsidized in exchange for feeding your data into Facebook.
Re: Virtual reality ads make their way to Facebook's Oculus headsets
#50Earlier quoted context omitted.
Aren't Oculus games typically $20-50? The price points for games always seemed very high to me. In an ideal world they'd offer a "no ads, full price" version and a "discount with ads" version. My guess is we'll probably just be left with "full price with ads" as the only option.
Or, in a worst case scenario, they will be free, with ads, and the ecosystem will turn into a trash fire like the mobile game market did.
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