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$1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

nytimes.com

41–50 of 54 posts

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#42
post #39
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Should I apologize in advanced for immigrating to the US next year?

paulpaul12 is having trouble splitting apart the ideas of: 1) cultural change due to changing minority/majority statistics 2) illegal immigration His/her opinions seem to be largely based on the idea that idea #1 is undesirable, and that idea #2 is what is causing that, therefore idea #2 is 'bad.' The fault in this argument is that idea #1 can come about through other means, such as legal immigration, and applying th…

He also has trouble separating both (1) and (2) from:

(3) the Great Recession and possibly his own troubles

To me it just seems like classic "they took our jerbs" style scapegoating.

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#43
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ha i dont see the demise of America just a swift cultural change. Again, Im for assimilation not a majority cultural change. As noted I never considered myself to be racist but after going to state parks in and around PA and MD I guess I am in this regards - sad to say. I finally felt what it feels like to be culturally lost and feel like a minority in my own backyard. I challenge anyone reading this that was born he…

I'm confused about your fixation on state parks in these posts. Why did going to a park cause you to come to these conclusions?

Well as an entrepreneur i am looking for safe spots on local rivers to rent kayaks and canoes.

Many proven safe spots are in state parks per my research. I haven't been to these same state parks since i was a kid - about 15 years ago. So when I went to check four different potential spots(each in various PA state parks) I was flabbergasted by each and everyones population - all hispanic.

I recall going to these parks back in the day and none were very crowded as they are now. Also, back then it was a melting pot of people enjoying the parks - black, white, hispanic, asian ... not just one culture and its not just a few families it's like 50 to 100 families on the weekends.

I guess that's what these posts are to point out .... that im flabbergasted(taken by surprise), dealing with racial tendencies i didnt know i had, as well my own selfish desire to create a business on these waters but can not due to this MASSIVE influx of immigrants getting in the way of this legal citizen's desire to build a business (i know u cant set up shop in a state park but there are ways around that point).

Im not hear to argue or to incite one ... im just here to point something that has taken me by surprise and learn to get over it. Maybe someone here has been to a state park recently and thought wow things are changing.....

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#44
post #42
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

paulpaul12 is having trouble splitting apart the ideas of: 1) cultural change due to changing minority/majority statistics 2) illegal immigration His/her opinions seem to be largely based on the idea that idea #1 is undesirable, and that idea #2 is what is causing that, therefore idea #2 is 'bad.' The fault in this argument is that idea #1 can come about through other means, such as legal immigration, and applying th…

He also has trouble separating both (1) and (2) from: (3) the Great Recession and possibly his own troubles To me it just seems like classic "they took our jerbs" style scapegoating.

  > it will be years before they have buying power
  > as a population to help our economy.
This isn't necessarily referring to the recession. I would just give the benefit of the doubt.

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#45
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh my I'm afraid your understanding of economics is very poor. Infrastructure funding can only come from tax money. Tax money can only come from the private sector. The private sector makes by money by using capital (savings). That is how it works. That is why savings are good and taxes are bad.

If his understanding of economics is poor, yours is even worse. All he saying is you get a better multiplier by giving it to people who will spend the money first on goods and services then on people who will put it directly into savings. And he's right, which should be obvious.

That is not true. That is redistribution wealth. You are taking the money away from the people are are making and giving to the people that are spending it. That makes no sense. Savings is what drives the economy. Without savings there would be no capital. omg.

Please tell me where this multiplier comes from? If money was multiplied through taxes the USSR would still be around and booming as they had an effective tax rate of 100%. So do tell please.

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#46
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as a population Racism is a form of collectivism, and that phrase is indisputably collectivist: http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/racism.html I agree that America should be a melting pot once again, but if you're going to champion American culture consistently, you must wipe collectivist ideas from your mind. We are all individuals, independent from one another, and we must be judged and thought of individually. Edit…

I'm not one of the downvoters, but my guess: 1. It's really irrelevant political squabbling. It's annoying, but even worse, that kind of sidetrack can ruin sites by bringing in people who seek nothing more than to argue. I've seen it on other sites. Probably a lot of people want to avoid that kind of slide. 2. Your apparent argument is illogical. "Racism is a form of collectivism, and that phrase is indisputably coll…

"and many people find Ayn Rand references annoying enough when they're on topic"

That doesn't mean they should vote it down. It's a legitimate point of view. It's mainstream enough to the point that her views are now taught in major universities. We're not going away.

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#47
post #15
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this scenario, anyone who'd just lost their job would have a lump sum of 40% of their previous salary, plus whatever entitlements they had for unemployment. Anyone still in a job would have that cash to either pay down their debts or to spend on goods and services that would sustain/create more jobs. It's a win/win scenario.

So, cut taxes while increasing benefits? You should run for Congress :)

The money would come from not bailing out the banks. Or rather, bailing them out via individual bank accounts. Power to the people!

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#48
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"hold on to extra cash" is intuitive but it is not how our economy works. Anyone saving money has that money circulated into the economy, through stocks, bonds, or bank lending. In fact, it is the wealthy who have the surplus capital available to invest in ventures like those you mention. It is extremely stimulative.

Nostromo specifically said, " not very stimulative. More money would be returned to high income individuals who are more likely to hold onto the extra cash." Which is exactly correct -- poor people spend basically every penny they get because they're forced to, while wealthier people will either pay down debt or save. Thus for a fixed stimulus, your best bang for the buck is income supports for unemployed / poor beca…

Krugman is a buffoon, his solution to every problem is " print more money".

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#49
post #47
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, cut taxes while increasing benefits? You should run for Congress :)

The money would come from not bailing out the banks. Or rather, bailing them out via individual bank accounts. Power to the people!

We turned a profit on bailing out the banks, actually. Or close to one, maybe lost a negligible amount when you weigh AIG against the profitable bailouts.

The issue with stimulus via tax cuts (which actually constituted 1/3 of the stimulus bill we did get, you don't hear about that much, because it undercuts the obama as devil-socialist narrative), is that, as pointed out above, you're primarily putting money back in the pockets of rich people. They'll invest it and maybe that will trickle down a little but it's nowhere near the multiplier effect for the economy that direct consumer spending gets you. Poorer people spend the money, that gets it bouncing around in the economy.

As a general ideological predisposition, tax cuts for the rich as a primary policy goal could theoretically make sense (although I'd suggest a hard look at the last 30 years first), but as fiscal stimulus for a down economy it just plain doesn't add up.

Re: $1 of every $5 in US wallets in 2010 came from programs like unemployment & SS

#50
post #14
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly does that do for the people who've been out of work? 100% rebate on 0 is still 0, right? Not to make a political statement out of things but you're saying you'd prefer they didn't get their unemployment, giving that money back to me and you as tax rebates instead? Trying to see how your suggestion is relevant to the article.

In this scenario, anyone who'd just lost their job would have a lump sum of 40% of their previous salary, plus whatever entitlements they had for unemployment. Anyone still in a job would have that cash to either pay down their debts or to spend on goods and services that would sustain/create more jobs. It's a win/win scenario.

40%? My income tax last year was 11% of salary. If I go back a few years, before I bought my house and before my company had a 401k that I could divert a lot of money to, the highest I paid was 18%.

How does one get to 40%?

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