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Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

theguardian.com

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Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#41

Post by dasudasu »

teachingassist wrote: post #20
enkid wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possible it's a side effect of something else. Maybe they are using directed microwaves to power eavesdropping equipment, and the individuals in proximity to that equipment are getting sick.

This makes it seem like friendly fire is a reasonable hypothesis - as some side-effect of physical security measures taken by the US government. Since the reported attacks generally happen within a radius of US locations requiring physical security - and apparently not in any other location. It's otherwise difficult to explain why the USA would be the singular target of these alleged attacks, for a period stretching…

Canadian diplomats were also affected in the case of Havana. They have good relationships with Cuba, send a good flow of tourists, and have no sanctions in place.

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#42

Post by LatteLazy »

Google234 wrote: post #2

Why don’t they install detectors inside all the embassies at risk to prove or disprove this? Why didn’t they do this earlier? I’m pretty sure there are many places that could be contracted to make a detector in a few weeks - this isn’t new technology. This seems really easy to test... so why are we still speculating.

If they did, there is no reason we would be told or the results would be made public.

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#43

Post by freeflight »

thoughtstheseus wrote: post #23
tqkxzugoaupvwqr wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you please explain in more detail why it makes sense to attack low-level staff? I can’t follow. Is it because low-level staff rotates more often and is only a short time in the country so effects won’t be connected to their stay in Kuba?

I’ll take a shot. If it takes years of exposure, or is delayed, to be effective you want to aim for staffers before they are in key/important positions. Maybe staffers in embassy positions track well into higher, more important jobs?

That would require more foreknowledge about career trajectories than even the US government itself has about its own people.

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#44

Post by bmicraft »

saalweachter wrote: post #36
mensetmanusman wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed-energy_weapon 2.4 GHz is used to heat your food in the microwave. Pulses that increase the fluence by an order of magnitude or more could probably boil water for a microsecond inside the brain and cause some strange reactions. What is unproven though, is how one would ever shrink the size of an electronic weapon like this.

The Active Denial System, listed on your link, causes pain by heating water in the skin. What is the proposed system for getting microwaves past the skin into the brain without creating the same effect as the ADS?

Using longer wavelengths should do exactly that.

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#45

Post by oh_sigh »

bArray wrote: post #28

Are microwave attacks something that is proven to exist? Can we replicate the effects on mice from some distance? Given the fact they pass through walls, this kind of bounds the frequency range the attacks could exist in... I would expect to see radio interference on nearby devices, etc (even if operating on a different frequency). I wouldn't be entirely surprised if these could be self-manifesting symptoms from peop…

This reminds me of the "I figured out what was wrong with my brain" post from a few days ago.

The entire blog was written as if the cause was "overthinking" and he physically depleted some resource in his brain leading to seizures. In reality the illness he linked to clearly states that it is a psychological condition of being overworked/stressed, and treatment needs to be "culturally sensitive" and done with CBT, which would not be the case if you were just missing some chemical in your brain.

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#46

Post by 13415 »

XorNot wrote: post #18
Swenrekcah wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the attack takes years or decades to have full cognitive detrimental effect, then it makes sense to attack the currently low-to-mid level staff.

How widespread can this equipment be though that none has ever been recovered as a weapon of the enemy? If you have enough resources to start targeting low to mid level staff, then you have to have a lot of practical devices which are mobile. While it's plausible the US has in fact recovered a whole bunch of them and kept it secret...why? The microwave attack rumor is common which means everyone is looking into wheth…

It could be extremely widespread if it is used by intelligence agencies, especially if the attacks are conducted by official embassy staff with diplomatic immunity abroad or by domestic intelligence operatives in the country.

For example, I don't think CIA operatives could easily snatch a car full of FSB agents on the streets of Moscow, confiscate their equipment, and get away with it. The same for Havana. (If they had a way to detect the attacks, they might try, but the point is even then it wouldn't be easy. AFAIK, operatives generally do not attack each other directly on foreign soil.)

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#47

Post by jasonhansel »

A question: why doesn't the government just expose Havana syndrome sufferers to various frequencies of microwaves and ask if it "sounds the same" as the sonic attacks? That would seem like a good way of ruling it out as a possibility.

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#48

Post by nabla9 »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #29
bArray wrote: post #28

Are microwave attacks something that is proven to exist? Can we replicate the effects on mice from some distance? Given the fact they pass through walls, this kind of bounds the frequency range the attacks could exist in... I would expect to see radio interference on nearby devices, etc (even if operating on a different frequency). I wouldn't be entirely surprised if these could be self-manifesting symptoms from peop…

Yes, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed-energy_weapon 2.4 GHz is used to heat your food in the microwave. Pulses that increase the fluence by an order of magnitude or more could probably boil water for a microsecond inside the brain and cause some strange reactions. What is unproven though, is how one would ever shrink the size of an electronic weapon like this.

Microwave transmitters are not that big. 4 kW generator or 100 kW pulse generator fits into a suitcase.

What you need is a horn antenna that directs the beam from the distance, across the street for example. It's also possible to have multiple horns around the target. Only in the intersection of the beams the radiation reaches dangerous levels.

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#49

Post by nabla9 »

saalweachter wrote: post #36
mensetmanusman wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed-energy_weapon 2.4 GHz is used to heat your food in the microwave. Pulses that increase the fluence by an order of magnitude or more could probably boil water for a microsecond inside the brain and cause some strange reactions. What is unproven though, is how one would ever shrink the size of an electronic weapon like this.

The Active Denial System, listed on your link, causes pain by heating water in the skin. What is the proposed system for getting microwaves past the skin into the brain without creating the same effect as the ADS?

Using the same frequency range as your home microwave does.

Re: Havana syndrome: NSA officer’s case hints at microwave attacks since 90s

#50

Post by rvba »

teachingassist wrote: post #20
enkid wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possible it's a side effect of something else. Maybe they are using directed microwaves to power eavesdropping equipment, and the individuals in proximity to that equipment are getting sick.

This makes it seem like friendly fire is a reasonable hypothesis - as some side-effect of physical security measures taken by the US government. Since the reported attacks generally happen within a radius of US locations requiring physical security - and apparently not in any other location. It's otherwise difficult to explain why the USA would be the singular target of these alleged attacks, for a period stretching…

Your post looks like disinformation. Something bad happens to US and Canadian diplomats in a foreign country, yet you find a way to blame USA.
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