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Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

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Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#41

Post by jonfw »

vineyardmike wrote: post #40
w0mbat wrote: post #18

All these stalking counter-measures make it useless if your device is stolen rather than mislaid. If my bag is stolen I want it to contain a hard to find device, not one that gives away its position (by warning the thief). I also want an easy mechanism to give the police temporary access to track it, til they catch the thief and get my stuff back.

I don’t know where you are, but in the US, if I gave the police a literal GPS coordinate of a stolen good, I still wouldnt expect them to actually go there and find it unless it’s of exceptionally high value (car, etc).

yep... I had a cell phone stolen when I was in high school, we could track it to a specific house, and they didn't even knock on the door.

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#42

Post by motohagiography »

Arainach wrote: post #33
fasteddie31003 wrote: post #31

I really hope these Airtags can reduce theft. Living in SF I had so many bikes, bags and motorcycles stolen. I'd love to have an Airtag in these things and show the police where my stolen item was. I wonder what law enforcement's response is going to be with the airtags? Will having an Airtag's location be enough for a warrent? Will people become vigilantes and try to get their stuff back without law enforcement?

> I wonder what law enforcement's response is going to be with the airtags? "Sorry, we have too many other cases" > Will having an Airtag's location be enough for a warrent? Probably not (see answer #1) > Will people become vigilantes and try to get their stuff back without law enforcement? Some of them, surely. Most of them, no. We already see this with things like bicycles that people are able to track down on Crai…

Startup of private airtag "recovery" services could be a thing.

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#43

Post by libeclipse »

w0mbat wrote: post #18

All these stalking counter-measures make it useless if your device is stolen rather than mislaid. If my bag is stolen I want it to contain a hard to find device, not one that gives away its position (by warning the thief). I also want an easy mechanism to give the police temporary access to track it, til they catch the thief and get my stuff back.

I would not trust police with location data or with getting my device back.

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#44

Post by [deleted] »

nodesocket wrote: post #23
w0mbat wrote: post #18

All these stalking counter-measures make it useless if your device is stolen rather than mislaid. If my bag is stolen I want it to contain a hard to find device, not one that gives away its position (by warning the thief). I also want an easy mechanism to give the police temporary access to track it, til they catch the thief and get my stuff back.

> give the police temporary access to track it, til they catch the thief and get my stuff back. I don’t know where you live, but as somebody who previously lived in San Francisco, do you really think the police are going to actively pursue theft claims? It’s why car break-ins and petty theft are out of control in the bay area. The police don’t enforce laws, and certainly don’t actively track down stolen property.

[deleted]

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#45

Post by jjkaczor »

dangoor wrote: post #19
vaillant wrote: post #12

This really feels like a losing battle - especially the part where you only get warned about being stalked by the AirTag if you have an iPhone. Having the technology to know where things are is great but we need to figure out how to account for bad actors somehow. I don’t have answers but tech companies can’t create the tools that enable harm and then wash their hands of it. Good for Apple for doing _something_, poin…

> especially the part where you only get warned about being stalked by the AirTag if you have an iPhone I believe that's not 100% true because of a final failsafe: the AirTag will start making noise if it's separated for too long (the definition of which could be an issue) from the owner's iPhone. That failsafe works if the person doesn't even have a smartphone. I don't know if there _is_ a perfect solution for this,…

The failsafe (audible alarm) looks like it would take a couple minutes to disable physically: https://www.iphonehacks.com/2021/04/airtag-teardown-reveals-...

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#46

Post by drdaeman »

djrogers wrote: post #35

There are a lot of comments here about how useless these protections are, because A or B already exist, or C works better for stalking. I think most of those comments are missing the real point here. If an Apple product were ever used to stalk - or God forbid, harm - an individual, it would be a big national story. If a Tile or a Samsung tag (or an amazon gps tracker made for stalking) were used in the same way, it w…

Would it really help, though?

A stalker, not stupid and well-aware about the protection, visits iFixit for a picture of internals, takes a drill, and physically obliterates the buzzer, right through the case. Epoxy or superglue for protection from the elements.

So they plant an Airtag, it gets found by accident, shit hits the fan, Apple's name goes in the news, journalists start journalist things, people don't are outraged and demand Apple's repentance, AirTags made of diamond-covered vibranium, including a microphone to control the buzzing and stopping working if buzzer is broken. PR problem not solved, and the core problem of humans not understanding technology is not solved.

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#47

Post by w0mbat »

vineyardmike wrote: post #40
w0mbat wrote: post #18

All these stalking counter-measures make it useless if your device is stolen rather than mislaid. If my bag is stolen I want it to contain a hard to find device, not one that gives away its position (by warning the thief). I also want an easy mechanism to give the police temporary access to track it, til they catch the thief and get my stuff back.

I don’t know where you are, but in the US, if I gave the police a literal GPS coordinate of a stolen good, I still wouldnt expect them to actually go there and find it unless it’s of exceptionally high value (car, etc).

If there was an easy mechanism to temporarily hand over tracking of stolen tags/iPhones/iPads to police, with the nice ultra wideband tracking that gives an arrow and direction, police would go and get a lot of stuff back. The police love low-hanging fruit and easy arrests.

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#48

Post by randyrand »

Arainach wrote: post #33
fasteddie31003 wrote: post #31

I really hope these Airtags can reduce theft. Living in SF I had so many bikes, bags and motorcycles stolen. I'd love to have an Airtag in these things and show the police where my stolen item was. I wonder what law enforcement's response is going to be with the airtags? Will having an Airtag's location be enough for a warrent? Will people become vigilantes and try to get their stuff back without law enforcement?

> I wonder what law enforcement's response is going to be with the airtags? "Sorry, we have too many other cases" > Will having an Airtag's location be enough for a warrent? Probably not (see answer #1) > Will people become vigilantes and try to get their stuff back without law enforcement? Some of them, surely. Most of them, no. We already see this with things like bicycles that people are able to track down on Crai…

if they get 200 reports to the same location they might investigate.

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#49

Post by filleduchaos »

w0mbat wrote: post #47
vineyardmike wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know where you are, but in the US, if I gave the police a literal GPS coordinate of a stolen good, I still wouldnt expect them to actually go there and find it unless it’s of exceptionally high value (car, etc).

If there was an easy mechanism to temporarily hand over tracking of stolen tags/iPhones/iPads to police, with the nice ultra wideband tracking that gives an arrow and direction, police would go and get a lot of stuff back. The police love low-hanging fruit and easy arrests.

Chasing down petty thieves is not the low hanging fruit most police departments go for.

Re: Apple reveals more about AirTag stalking protections

#50

Post by sokoloff »

vineyardmike wrote: post #40
w0mbat wrote: post #18

All these stalking counter-measures make it useless if your device is stolen rather than mislaid. If my bag is stolen I want it to contain a hard to find device, not one that gives away its position (by warning the thief). I also want an easy mechanism to give the police temporary access to track it, til they catch the thief and get my stuff back.

I don’t know where you are, but in the US, if I gave the police a literal GPS coordinate of a stolen good, I still wouldnt expect them to actually go there and find it unless it’s of exceptionally high value (car, etc).

If it was anything less than a kidnapped police officer or child, I wouldn't expect them to do anything.
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