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Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

houstonchronicle.com

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Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#41

Post by enraged_camel »

akvadrako wrote: post #34
soco wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are wind farms currently running in Alaska[1] which is arguably colder than Texas. The cold-related downsides seem to be well known and already addressed, so it's definitely not a technical issue here. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_Alaska

It's a technical issue because the investment and power required to for the deicing necessary greatly reduces their efficiency. It's an interesting question if Texas should require all turbines to have deicing capabilities which are almost never used.

>> It's a technical issue because the investment and power required to for the deicing necessary greatly reduces their efficiency.

Interesting. Can you provide sources for reading?

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#42

Post by willis936 »

irjustin wrote: post #4
aseerdbnarng wrote: post #3

I understand that natural gas plants were just as impacted by the storm as renewables ( https://www.texastribune.org/2021/02/16/natural-gas-power-st... ) so it is not clear this bill is being passed in good faith

Yes, the loud politicians have always been painting this as a Green/Wind vs Fossil problem as soon as the storm hit and that the solution is Fossil. It's frustrating because unlike other debates - the underlying truth is quite clear. Cold temperatures affected both Natural Gas & Wind bringing both power types[0]. Winterizing both can be beneficial. Wind can operating in those temperatures just fine[1]. It wouldn't be…

The right are not interested in regulation. Treating power as a utility is the government overreaching on the free market.

It was a left vs right issue before the power went out. The right are just in a weak political position because they are responsible for a disaster and want to control the narrative.

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#43

Post by vinay427 »

afrcnc wrote: post #36

Americans sure like their grifting politicians, I see

This issue involves the Texas government pitched against US legislation. I'm sure there's a more accurate group to refer to than "Americans," which doesn't make sense to me in this context.

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#44

Post by blunte »

What many here may not realize is that amongst certain groups in the US, people are not exposed to complete information. And in cases where they are, it tends to create cognitive dissonance with the narratives they have heard repeated frequently on a few "news" sources and by their friends.

Immediately after the severe cold period passed, I heard from friends and family in Texas that they survived DESPITE the failures of the wind farms which "Biden forced" upon them. Now keep in mind, Biden had only been president for about one month. When I politely provided more details, such as the ratio of natural gas powerplants vs wind, and the failure rate of both, the common reply was, "Well let's not fuss over that now."

This has been a long process of disinformation and brainwashing that has occurred, to the point where there is frankly no rational thought involved in politics there. Whoever you or "your people" think are bad, you want exactly the opposite of what they want. It is mindless and pointless and destructive.

It may take another 20 years, but unless Texas shifts its policies and behavior, it will become another "once was" stories. Anyway with any awareness of reality will move away, leaving the rest to architect their own demise.

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#45

Post by bradfa »

It'd be interesting to see Texas tax deployments of wind and solar within the state but incentivize manufacturing of wind and solar. If oil and gas exports from Texas are going to decline in coming years, having wind and solar exports increase would be a nice logical offset. And even if oil/gas exports don't decline it does seem like manufacturing of wind/solar products will only increase so it would be seemingly low risk.

If Texas doesn't want to deploy wind and solar I don't think anyone outside of the state is going to change their mind. But they should realize that if the feds are going to dump huge amounts of money via rebates or tax credits into wind and solar that there's a huge market to design and manufacture those products within the USA. Texas likely has the ability to make itself into a leader in wind and solar engineering and manufacturing (if they aren't already).

Lots of tech companies seem to already be flocking to Texas (much to the chagrin of Texans) so maybe my idea above would be met with harsh criticism from those who live in Texas (I do not).

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#46

Post by adamcstephens »

willis936 wrote: post #42
irjustin wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the loud politicians have always been painting this as a Green/Wind vs Fossil problem as soon as the storm hit and that the solution is Fossil. It's frustrating because unlike other debates - the underlying truth is quite clear. Cold temperatures affected both Natural Gas & Wind bringing both power types[0]. Winterizing both can be beneficial. Wind can operating in those temperatures just fine[1]. It wouldn't be…

The right are not interested in regulation. Treating power as a utility is the government overreaching on the free market. It was a left vs right issue before the power went out. The right are just in a weak political position because they are responsible for a disaster and want to control the narrative.

The Republicans control most of the statehouses, while the Democrats barely hold together a weak majority in Congress. I’m not sure I’d go so far as to say the right has a weak political position.

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#47

Post by coldcode »

missurunha wrote: post #39
jeltz wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can't with current technology. Wind can handle cold but not storms. Wind is the hardest power source to protect against the elements.

Wind turbines usually brake after 25m/s wind speeds for safety reasons. They stopped working in Texas cause they were frozen, not because it was too windy.

Clearly this is a Texas only problem, given it works in much colder countries and States. Texas did not want to pay to winterize to maximize profits. Risk reward, a few hundred dead people once in a while vs. profits every year.

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#48

Post by hef19898 »

makomk wrote: post #18
aseerdbnarng wrote: post #3

I understand that natural gas plants were just as impacted by the storm as renewables ( https://www.texastribune.org/2021/02/16/natural-gas-power-st... ) so it is not clear this bill is being passed in good faith

Yeah, the big problem is the death of coal power. Coal power plants can stockpile enough fuel to run for a good while no matter the weather. Natural gas power plants cannot; they rely on a continuous supply of gas, and it turns out that every part of the Texas natural gas supply chain is vulnerable to cold weather and power outages. Fixing this will be slow, incredibly expensive, probably increase CO2 emissions and d…

Gas from Russia is pretty much used across Europe, coming through pipelines, regardless of weather.

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#49

Post by elif »

bradfa wrote: post #45

It'd be interesting to see Texas tax deployments of wind and solar within the state but incentivize manufacturing of wind and solar. If oil and gas exports from Texas are going to decline in coming years, having wind and solar exports increase would be a nice logical offset. And even if oil/gas exports don't decline it does seem like manufacturing of wind/solar products will only increase so it would be seemingly low…

The crazy thing is texas has among the best wind conditions in the country, and is also the center of structural steel.

Re: Texas Senate passes bill aiming to counter federal subsidies for wind and solar

#50

Post by willis936 »

adamcstephens wrote: post #46
willis936 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The right are not interested in regulation. Treating power as a utility is the government overreaching on the free market. It was a left vs right issue before the power went out. The right are just in a weak political position because they are responsible for a disaster and want to control the narrative.

The Republicans control most of the statehouses, while the Democrats barely hold together a weak majority in Congress. I’m not sure I’d go so far as to say the right has a weak political position.

Semantics. My point is that it costs political capital to be responsible for an easily avoidable disaster.
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