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If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

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Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#41

Post by rblatz »

totalZero wrote: post #29
kevindong wrote: post #16

This *FEELS* (not saying it is) like a false claim. Much like the much upvoted (and later debunked) HN post from a while back when a iOS developer claimed that Apple always keeps it 30% commission, even on a refunded purchase. I consider it worrying that a claim wholly lacking evidence is getting so much attention. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23995750

Do you have any evidence aside from a feeling? Just curious.

This would be egregious behavior by Apple, and the Apple Card has been out long enough that there would be numerous reports of this that gained steam by now. It's also been out long enough and distributed to enough people that someone somewhere was likely to encounter two issues with Apple at about the same time. So it's much more likely that Apple doesn't just suspend all your accounts until you pay up.

Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#42

Post by ssully »

samatman wrote: post #27

So, little embarrassed to admit this, but: I plumb forgot to set up autopay on my Apple Card when I first got it. I set it up to pay a few subscriptions and promptly forgot about it. As a result, I carried a balance for I think three months without making payments, and only noticed when I hit my credit limit. This was an expensive mistake, and also dinged my credit score for about four months. Still kinda mad at myse…

Literally just talked to a friend a few days ago who did this same exact thing. He carried a balance for about 2 months and also did not have his account disabled.

Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#43

Post by _jal »

davismwfl wrote: post #11
pgm8705 wrote: post #6

I'm guessing (and hoping) this is a bug and not intentional, but this is pretty scary. My digital personal life is almost all within Apple's ecosystem, including most of the smart devices in my house. Getting locked out for any amount of time would be super frustrating.

This is not a bug, this is by design. There is no possible way this wasn't spec'd as a test scenario to force payment compliance. They know they have leverage that a bank wouldn't have so they are using it.

And you know this.. how?

Or are you simply following a chain of assumptions to a place that meets your opinion of Apple?

Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#45

Post by ksec »

brundolf wrote: post #31

Important detail: > The only thing Apple Card was paying for was the 2TB iCloud upgrade — and when I try to change the payment method, it refuses and says “Your account has been disabled in the App Store and iTunes.” It's not hard to imagine a payment issue for iCloud causing iCloud to be locked or otherwise limited, and given that Apple's online services tend to be buggy and unreliable it's not a huge stretch to thi…

Are you suggesting it is a fraud detection? Which sounds like one if he was changing payment info. ( Like doing it with VPN )

Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#46

Post by nemothekid »

kevindong wrote: post #16

This *FEELS* (not saying it is) like a false claim. Much like the much upvoted (and later debunked) HN post from a while back when a iOS developer claimed that Apple always keeps it 30% commission, even on a refunded purchase. I consider it worrying that a claim wholly lacking evidence is getting so much attention. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23995750

Yes, I don't think Apple Card has anything to do with it - I think his iCloud subscription was past due and that was that disabled his account - and then he found himself in a Catch 22 where he couldn't update/pay his Apple Card because he was locked out of iCloud. I'd imagine the same would have happened if he let his Visa card lapse.

Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#47

Post by dcurtis »

nemothekid wrote: post #46
kevindong wrote: post #16

This *FEELS* (not saying it is) like a false claim. Much like the much upvoted (and later debunked) HN post from a while back when a iOS developer claimed that Apple always keeps it 30% commission, even on a refunded purchase. I consider it worrying that a claim wholly lacking evidence is getting so much attention. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23995750

Yes, I don't think Apple Card has anything to do with it - I think his iCloud subscription was past due and that was that disabled his account - and then he found himself in a Catch 22 where he couldn't update/pay his Apple Card because he was locked out of iCloud. I'd imagine the same would have happened if he let his Visa card lapse.

Nope -- iCloud was not past due. It is an Apple Card policy.

Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#48

Post by caymanjim »

samatman wrote: post #27

So, little embarrassed to admit this, but: I plumb forgot to set up autopay on my Apple Card when I first got it. I set it up to pay a few subscriptions and promptly forgot about it. As a result, I carried a balance for I think three months without making payments, and only noticed when I hit my credit limit. This was an expensive mistake, and also dinged my credit score for about four months. Still kinda mad at myse…

> So, little embarrassed to admit this, but: I plumb forgot to set up autopay on my Apple Card when I first got it.

Why is that embarassing? Why on earth would you set up auto-pay? That's just asking for a headache if anything is every compromised, or if a vendor fraudulently or accidentally overcharges you. Reversing charges from your bank is a headache, and rogue charges can quickly cascade into a series of overdrafts, other failed payments, etc. Good luck getting reimbursed for all the charges if that happens, and hope it doesn't get you into a situation where you can't pay an important bill.

It's madness to ever allow automatic financial transactions that aren't fixed, scheduled payments from trusted vendors.

Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#49

Post by davismwfl »

davismwfl wrote: post #11
pgm8705 wrote: post #6

I'm guessing (and hoping) this is a bug and not intentional, but this is pretty scary. My digital personal life is almost all within Apple's ecosystem, including most of the smart devices in my house. Getting locked out for any amount of time would be super frustrating.

This is not a bug, this is by design. There is no possible way this wasn't spec'd as a test scenario to force payment compliance. They know they have leverage that a bank wouldn't have so they are using it.

First, of course I could be wrong on this (or it could be a false claim as some have suggested), but a few reasons I said this is intentional and not a defect of code.

1. The OP in a response tweet said it took ~15 days before his accounts were disabled and a few more before he linked to two things together. Meaning likely there is a process that the bank handling the actual card sends details to Apple on some interval which says who is late etc, and when Apple got it they then process the disabling of accounts.

2. If it was unintentional I'd expect Apple to have an easy and quick resolution to fixing it, and I'd also think if Apple's systems were that linked it would have happened more immediate not taken ~15 days.

3. The reason it would take 3-5 days to re-enable the Apple ID's and associated services would be because the bank has to update their records for payment and then send notice to Apple that the user is current, hence it isn't an immediate task and takes a small process with associated delays. This fits the description of what the user stated.

Lastly, personally, Apple has been helpful to me in the past when a company I was working with had an issue with our corporate Apple ID & services. Apple support were able to unlock the account (and associated services) after just a couple of hours of back and forth and they were clear their managers had clear ability to enable/disable Apple ID's. I am sure they have some decision tree they use but it was immediate once the support woman told me it was reactivated I could immediately log in, no delay.

Re: If you miss an Apple Card payment, Apple disables all your Apple accounts

#50

Post by caeril »

sneak wrote: post #12

After a decade deep into the Apple/iOS ecosystem, I now make a unique disposable Apple ID for each and every mobile device, and eschew all paid apps. I don't use iCloud at all. I don't use an Apple ID on desktops at all, save for one that has its own disposable one for certain essential apps that are not available elsewhere (Apple Configurator 2 is required to restore M1 macs). Making entirely unlinked/unique Apple I…

> because each one requires a working phone number to create

This isn't true. I have an email-only apple account that works fine. My lock screen constantly carries a "Verify your phone number" badge that's rather annoying, but otherwise everything functions.

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