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Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

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Re: Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

#41
post #38

It’s hard for me to fathom the mind of an authoritarian. Imagine being so mad at a speech you want to imprison someone. Isn’t this a sign of mental illness? I denigrate myself all the time with humor. This is my strategy to keeping an open mind on self improvement.

If you only knew some Russian. There is a drama now happening on Youtube with former presitator of Kazakhstan, where his past subordinates now surface and dump their personal accounts of him. As could've been imagined, none are positive of his personal ability. But the biggest insecurity of such people is to appear to be useless. He very much understands that he surrounded himself with sharks, and able lieutenants wh…

presitator = ???

president + dictator?

Re: Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps the white guy should debate with Jack Ma in Chinese? Ever thought about that?

I wish we hadn’t left behind latin as an international language that everyone has to learn as a second language (to keep things equal). Fairly or not, English is the international language of science, technology, and culture. There are some major benefits of learning a second language, so I wouldn’t say it’s completely ‘fair’ to English speakers who have no incentive at all to learn a second language and receive the…

Latin isn’t some neutral communication protocol the entire would or could easily adopt. Why not Classical Chinese? More people spoke that and it also underpins numerous modern languages.

Re: Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

#45
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair with Ma, he doesn't seem to have the level of English required to have a smart conversation with a native speaker. I couldn't conclude much from that interview regarding his intellect.

Perhaps the white guy should debate with Jack Ma in Chinese? Ever thought about that?

Or a black guy should have debated with him instead, because apparently skin colour has something to do with language.

Re: Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

#46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A similar thing happened to one of my favorite actresses, Fan Bingbing. Here is a good article with background: https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2019/03/the-untold-stor...

I'm pretty sure she was caught for tax avoidance and/or corruption. Hence why she was locked up for a while.

> caught for tax avoidance and/or corruption.

On the other hand, it seems feasible that could just be the excuse given. Whether or not that's the reality of things, who knows...

Re: Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

#47

Would love to get a transcript of exactly what he said at a forum a few months ago, from Quartz: Speaking at a forum attended by some of China’s most powerful figures in politics and finance, Ma heavily criticized the “pawnshop mentality” of Chinese banks, and accused global authorities’ old-school financial regulation of slowing down innovation. The criticism eventually reached Chinese president Xi Jinping, who was…

bigger reason than Alibaba's market control is the fact that the Chinese government is absolutely allergic to unsecured debt. China over the last few years has desperately attempted, and with some sucess, cleaned up parts of its financial sector because the government fears few things more than a financial crisis, it's something they learned when they came out ahead in 2008/2009. relevant read: https://www.nakedcapit…

I remember reading https://marginalrevolution.com/ back around the time of the 2008 financial crisis. Tyler Cowen was emphasizing the futility of trying to regulate the financial system. The banks paid big money to hire the smartest guys; the regulators had to make do with who they could get. The Collateralized Debt Obligation genie was out of the bottle and you couldn't get it back in.

One has to wonder how that looks from China. The government of the USA looks impressively powerful, yet it lost control of the financial sector. Some players in the American financial sector believed in CDOs and lost their own money. Others saw it as just another scam, with private profits and socialized losses.

To Chinese eyes that probably looks like corruption with extra steps. In particular, the US government could retain some legitimacy with a "Wall Street" versus "Main Street" narrative. Sure, Uncle Sam got ripped off by bankers, but what can you do?

The Chinese government is worried that corruption will cause it to lose its legitimacy with the Chinese people. But the Chinese people won't let the Chinese government away with the "It is the Banksters not the Officials." line. They don't see the top people as two warring clans, with Bankers beyond the reach of discipline by Officials.

So the Chinese government has to look several moves ahead. First come the CDOs. As the bubble builds the government finds that it is trapped: too many people are dependent on easy money for the government to pop the bubble. As the bubble inflates, the government tries to regulate its way out of trouble by deflating the CDO bubble. Here the Chinese government has second-mover advantage. It can see that the US government lost control and could not do anything, not even close. Eventually the bubble pops, leading to a financial crisis and the Chinese government gets the blame. It must have noticed that the US government didn't manage to shift the blame with long prison sentences for bankers, the US government had somehow lost control.

So I don't think that "absolutely allergic to unsecured debt." is quite it. My guess is that the Chinese government sees the US government losing control of the financial sector, years (ten? twenty?) ahead of the financial sector misbehaving and causing a government-shaking crisis. The Chinese government don't want finance building itself up as a separate (and irresponsible) power center. The American experience is that this happens slowly, little by little, but on a ratchet. A ratchet with a magic pawl that the government cannot lift. So the Chinese government has to nip it in the bud.

Re: Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

#48

An analogy for western audiences comes to mind. Imagine if Elon Musk had criticized Trump two months ago and then hadn’t been seen or heard of since then.

Quite an analogy with an assumption that "speech" is the only thing Jack Ma could have done wrong....

Re: Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

#49

It’s hard for me to fathom the mind of an authoritarian. Imagine being so mad at a speech you want to imprison someone. Isn’t this a sign of mental illness? I denigrate myself all the time with humor. This is my strategy to keeping an open mind on self improvement.

I find this sort of flippant posturing and minimization much more disturbing than a higher-profile-than-usual disappearance.

Acting as if these horrific, nebulous governing systems can be reduced to the image of a Saturday-morning cartoon villain, an infantile mustache-twirler angrily shaking his fist at the TV screen.

It is not “offense”. A system does not get “get mad”. It constantly sniffs for the slightest hint of dissent, any figure that might even come close to nudging public opinion the wrong way, and grinds it to dust.

It’s no different from every other country’s power-seeking and preserving systems, just with a much more sensitive trigger-finger, and that seemingly excessive sensitivity and reactivity is simply because they can. Not because some CCP higher-up has a fragile ego.

Re: Jack Ma has not been seen in public for two months

#50

An analogy for western audiences comes to mind. Imagine if Elon Musk had criticized Trump two months ago and then hadn’t been seen or heard of since then.

Quite an analogy with an assumption that "speech" is the only thing Jack Ma could have done wrong....

Even if Jack Ma did something wrong, being disappeared without explanation is not exactly great :P

And certainly his speech seems to have caused offense shortly before this disappearance.

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