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FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

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Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#41

Post by stjohnswarts »

maxerickson wrote: post #10
roody15 wrote: post #8

Hmm super expensive hard to transport Pfizer vaccine ... first to be approved. Next Moderna ... also super expensive second to be approved. After six months to a year ... and after making huge profits.... Then the AstraZeneca/Russian vaccine variants will be “found” to be also effective. We must first wait and let Pfizer make a few billion !!!

It's $40, not super expensive. 600 million doses would cost $25 billion, a trifle compared to how much the pandemic is costing.

This is why I was so angry to find out that the Trump administration passed on 100 million doses. Are you kidding me? And they didn't have to pay for them if it wasn't proven to be effective. There was literally no downside! This has just been a terrible Presidency from all angles.

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#42

Post by stjohnswarts »

shoo wrote: post #14
maxerickson wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's $40, not super expensive. 600 million doses would cost $25 billion, a trifle compared to how much the pandemic is costing.

> Belgium’s budget state secretary, Eva De Bleeker, posted the price list on Twitter, with the amounts of each vaccine that her country intends to buy from the EU. The tweet was quickly deleted, but not soon enough to prevent interested parties taking screenshots, which have now made it public knowledge. This is the list of what the EU is paying: Oxford/AstraZeneca: €1.78 (£1.61) Johnson & Johnson: $8.50 (£6.30) Sano…

I mean does anyone even care if it's under $100? Given what it has cost economies all over the world it is a drop in the ocean.

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#43

Post by stjohnswarts »

djsumdog wrote: post #13
maxerickson wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's $40, not super expensive. 600 million doses would cost $25 billion, a trifle compared to how much the pandemic is costing.

Well hundreds of millions have already flowed into every major pharma company for development costs, so the price for tax payers in every contributing country is substantially higher than $40/person. That's just the price an individual may see.

You're kidding right? The whole operation "Warp Speed" was a bit over $10 billion, that is a pittance compared to the trillions spent to keep the economy from collapsing.

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#44

Post by eganist »

enchiridion wrote: post #6
eganist wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and stopped vaccinating people who already had COVID How would you propose doing this without drawing blood from every single person getting a vaccine?

Seem like a good option. I'd imagine it's a parallel supply chain, so it would speed things up.

it's most definitely not. The application and collection points aren't even the same because there's a time delay in antibody testing.

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#45

Post by stjohnswarts »

aphextron wrote: post #19
roody15 wrote: post #8

Hmm super expensive hard to transport Pfizer vaccine ... first to be approved. Next Moderna ... also super expensive second to be approved. After six months to a year ... and after making huge profits.... Then the AstraZeneca/Russian vaccine variants will be “found” to be also effective. We must first wait and let Pfizer make a few billion !!!

What exactly is wrong with allowing a company to profit from performing a literal miracle?

No one has a problem with it save maybe 1-5% who want a communist type economic system. At least in the USA. Someone is going to pay for it.

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#46

Post by stjohnswarts »

systemvoltage wrote: post #33
handmodel wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US that is what is happening - no one is paying for the vaccine. It is intellectually vapid to get worked about the fact companies are making a $15 marginal unit profit on a vaccine that has 10x the utility of the average annual physical but costs 1/10th as much.

I wasn't aware it is free in the US. That's great.

For what it's worth both Trump and Biden stated as much regardless of who won the election.

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#47

Post by gnicholas »

lisper wrote: post #20
FreakyT wrote: post #7

Glad to hear it! One key advantage of the Moderna one versus the similar Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine is that it doesn't require deep freeze storage, only regular freezing temperatures. (-90º C for Pfizer/BioNTech vs -20º C for Moderna)

Does anyone here know the reason for the difference? They're both mRNA vaccines, right? So why does one need a deep freeze and the other one not?

According to NPR [1]

> Moderna spokesperson Colleen Hussey explained to NPR in an email that its vaccine doesn't need to be kept so cold because of its particular "lipid nanoparticle properties and structure," and because the company has learned from experience — it's developed ten mRNA vaccine candidates already. "Now we don't need [ultra-cold conditions] as the quality of product has improved and [it] doesn't need to be highly frozen to avoid mRNA degradation," Hussey explained.

and

> It's possible that Pfizer's vaccine could eventually be shown to be stable in somewhat warmer conditions — or for longer times out of the freezer.

1: https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/11/17/9355633...

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#48

Post by Retric »

seanwilson wrote: post #40
refurb wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has been involved in stability testing before, I doubt this is really the case. In order to justify your stability, you need data to submit to the FDA (they don't take your word for it). When doing your initial stability studies, you try and collect data for the most ideal conditions - no refrigeration needed, stable for X years from room temperature to 30C (to account for conditions during shipment).…

> stable for X years from room temperature to 30C How do you get this data for a large value of X without having to wait X years?

The general rule is increasing temperature by 10C roughly doubles the rate of chemical reactions. https://www.ddltesting.com/package-testing/shelf-life-testin...

Though in practice it’s more complicated. Basically, make predictions based on accelerated testing and then validate them in real time tests. So, if things hold up at 3 and 6 months real time you can probably trust them over longer timeframes.

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#49

Post by stjohnswarts »

stu2b50 wrote: post #17
roody15 wrote: post #8

Hmm super expensive hard to transport Pfizer vaccine ... first to be approved. Next Moderna ... also super expensive second to be approved. After six months to a year ... and after making huge profits.... Then the AstraZeneca/Russian vaccine variants will be “found” to be also effective. We must first wait and let Pfizer make a few billion !!!

Ah yes, it's definitely a conspiracy, not the fact that the Biontech/Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are RNA based, which are far faster to make, but which also are known to break down at high temperatures while AstraZeneca is a traditional vaccine. Yep, it's definitely not the logical reason but Big Pharma and the US government and Germany at it again.

I wouldn't say far faster. Russia and China have both come up with vaccines in a similar amount of time. We haven't seen any details on how effective they are compared. J&J is making a more traditional vaccine and it should be finishing up the Stage 3 study in a month or two and be ready for approval. They're hoping it will be a single dose vaccine

Re: FDA grants authorization to Moderna's Covid-19 vaccine

#50

Post by opendomain »

I am concerned that the Pfizer vaccine was put on hold [1]. I am also concerned that Moderna has never produced ANY drug beyond the third stage before. [2]

How could we research if the approval was politically motivated? How can I know if this is actually safe?

(1) https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/12/white-house-delays-p...

(2) https://www.wsj.com/articles/modernas-covid-19-vaccine-is-cl...

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