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Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

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Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#41

Post by brigade »

blauditore wrote: post #37
bredren wrote: post #29

I’ve had the XDR Pro Display since June, and use it primarily for dev. I just trusted Apple in their focus on this direction. Suffice it to say I am very happy with it. What I like about conclusions of this piece is it points to how strategic Apple is thinking in its leverage due to the breadth of distribution of advanced hardware and software. Apple is able to set entire new standards of expectation for customers th…

> Apple is able to set entire new standards of expectation for customers that are _very_ hard for competitors to follow. The cheaper version of this display has a price tag of $5k, the more expensive one $6k. I never spent even remotely as much money on a display, so I cannot speak from first-hand experience. But a quick search for graphics-design displays yields several competitor products that have similar or bette…

Much less? Which display?

The closest competitor I’ve found is the PA32UCX at $4500, and supposedly its fan is noisy enough that I’m hesitant to buy it.

Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#42

Post by briandear »

blauditore wrote: post #37
bredren wrote: post #29

I’ve had the XDR Pro Display since June, and use it primarily for dev. I just trusted Apple in their focus on this direction. Suffice it to say I am very happy with it. What I like about conclusions of this piece is it points to how strategic Apple is thinking in its leverage due to the breadth of distribution of advanced hardware and software. Apple is able to set entire new standards of expectation for customers th…

> Apple is able to set entire new standards of expectation for customers that are _very_ hard for competitors to follow. The cheaper version of this display has a price tag of $5k, the more expensive one $6k. I never spent even remotely as much money on a display, so I cannot speak from first-hand experience. But a quick search for graphics-design displays yields several competitor products that have similar or bette…

What’s not revealed in “specs” is the quality of execution of those specs.

Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#43

Post by kuschku »

dijit wrote: post #38
blauditore wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple is able to set entire new standards of expectation for customers that are _very_ hard for competitors to follow. The cheaper version of this display has a price tag of $5k, the more expensive one $6k. I never spent even remotely as much money on a display, so I cannot speak from first-hand experience. But a quick search for graphics-design displays yields several competitor products that have similar or bette…

When the XDR came out it was competing with monitors that were 40,000 USD and up. (With some compromises like the stand which is just an art piece and the viewing angles being squiff). If the competition is now priced competitively then that’s very good for consumers.

The competition was also before the XDR similarly priced. Asus had 2 or 3 at that price point, and Apple had the XDR.

And then there's the Dell UP2718Q, almost entirely the exact same specs, but only 4K, at 1600€. Released 2017, years before the XDR.

Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#44

Post by Budabellly »

crazygringo wrote: post #36

Wow, that's crazy, it actually works -- just tried out the sample videos in QuickTime on my 2016 13" MBP (P3 gamut, running Big Sur) and confirmed working. Basically: if I set my display to ~75% brightness and open the video, the whites in the video are 100% brightness, way brighter than #FFF interface white on the rest of my screen. But if I increase my display brightness to 100%, the whites in the video are the sam…

If you pop open Digital Color Meter app (macOS system util), are there any differences between the whites in the video and the #fff interface whites?

Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#45

Post by rbx »

dijit wrote: post #38
blauditore wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple is able to set entire new standards of expectation for customers that are _very_ hard for competitors to follow. The cheaper version of this display has a price tag of $5k, the more expensive one $6k. I never spent even remotely as much money on a display, so I cannot speak from first-hand experience. But a quick search for graphics-design displays yields several competitor products that have similar or bette…

When the XDR came out it was competing with monitors that were 40,000 USD and up. (With some compromises like the stand which is just an art piece and the viewing angles being squiff). If the competition is now priced competitively then that’s very good for consumers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtd7UzLJHrU Comparison with the 40k display here. Apple doesn't come very close. Sure it's much cheaper. But then why compare.

Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#46

Post by AnssiH »

noobquestion81 wrote: post #16
AnssiH wrote: post #13

When still talking about mixed SDR+HDR content on a HDR display having differently mapped whites, the article says: > it’s strange and new, and possibly unique to Apple. But that is exactly how Windows 10 does it with HDR displays, too. So not really unique to Apple. To the article's benefit, it did say "possibly" :) I'm using Win 10 myself with an HDR display, and HDR white appears brighter than "desktop" white just…

apple uses this technique on non-HDR displays tho.

Yep, that part might be unique to Apple. Possibly.

Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#47

Post by Androider »

AnssiH wrote: post #13

When still talking about mixed SDR+HDR content on a HDR display having differently mapped whites, the article says: > it’s strange and new, and possibly unique to Apple. But that is exactly how Windows 10 does it with HDR displays, too. So not really unique to Apple. To the article's benefit, it did say "possibly" :) I'm using Win 10 myself with an HDR display, and HDR white appears brighter than "desktop" white just…

The Windows HDR implementation is complete crap, exactly because they don't have have full control of the hardware stack as Apple does and can't change all the monitor settings like they would need to.

When you toggle HDR on Windows, the desktop becomes dull gray and desaturated exactly because they pull down the previous desktop brightness to something less than 255. So you have to then adjust your monitor's brightness up to compensate. The monitor's brightness effectively sets the upper cap of the HDR brightness, so let's say your brightness was set at 50% before, now you've got to fiddle with the monitor to boost the screen brightness to 100% to allow HDR to function, and to achieve your previous desktop white brightness (you'll probably also have to adjust the software "desktop white" point slider you mentioned, since MS has no clue what the correct monitor brightness and SDR pull down amount should be, so good luck matching your previous desktop colors and brightness). In my experience very few people successfully manage to setup their Windows HDR correctly, and even if you do there's no way to "seamlessly" switch between the two modes (which you have to do since tons of stuff on Windows doesn't work properly when HDR mode is enabled). I haven't checked Surface or other MS hardware, perhaps they're able to do something more clever there?

What Apple does, is that when your display brightness is 50% and you display HDR content, the HDR content will seamlessly appear at a brightness somewhere between 75% to 100% of the maximum screen brightness. That is a seamless HDR effect, giving you the whiter than white experience next to your other windows that just works.

Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#49

Post by dreamer7 »

Budabellly wrote: post #44
crazygringo wrote: post #36

Wow, that's crazy, it actually works -- just tried out the sample videos in QuickTime on my 2016 13" MBP (P3 gamut, running Big Sur) and confirmed working. Basically: if I set my display to ~75% brightness and open the video, the whites in the video are 100% brightness, way brighter than #FFF interface white on the rest of my screen. But if I increase my display brightness to 100%, the whites in the video are the sam…

If you pop open Digital Color Meter app (macOS system util), are there any differences between the whites in the video and the #fff interface whites?

Just tried this on my Macbook Pro. It was easier to just go to YouTube and search for HDR videos than downloading the sample in the article.

Digital Color Meter shows both UI white and video white as exactly #fff despite the video white being much brighter!

Even at full screen brightness, the video white was noticeably brighter

Re: Apple’s “Extended Dynamic Range” Brings HDR to Non-HDR Displays

#50

Post by kuschku »

fortran77 wrote: post #7

> The company, long known for shipping high quality, color-accurate displays, This is simply not true; a lie. Everyone in Hollywood and the professional print world who needed color-accurate displays that could be calibrated were using HP Dreamcolor Displays or similar products from companies like BenQ ( For example: https://nofilmschool.com/2017/12/benq-sw271-color-management... ) No movie studio does professional c…

Btw, if you want pretty much the same specs with native 10-bit support and 1000 nits peak brightness for pretty much the same price, the UP2718Q has been discounted quite a bit recently (I got one for myself)
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