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Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

pnas.org

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Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#41

Post by jointpdf »

leoh wrote: post #30

I've been using the mobile device made by Heartmath lately — https://store.heartmath.com/tech/ . It looks at HRV (heart rate variability) and gives you a realtime plot, thereby offering visual feedback about how my breathing is affecting how steady the time between heartbeats is. Hearthmath calls low HRV "coherence" and getting into a lower HRV state (i.e. via regular, smooth breathing; maybe 1 in/out breath each ~10…

Interesting. I have an EEG headband (Muse) that tracks a single composite measure of “calmness” while meditating. When I use it, the graph looks like a random walk—it barely registers what subjectively feels like a deep state of calm. I just assumed it didn’t work and stopped using it.

Then I gave it to my dad, who has been an ER doctor for 40 years but has no knowledge of or experience with meditation. Within seconds, his calmness graph plummeted to the minimum value (lower = better) and flatlined. There was a brief spike in attention when the dishwasher changed cycles in the other room, then it cratered again. He just nonchalantly explained that he can control his heart rate to calm himself down, which sounds like a superpower to me.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#42

Post by renewiltord »

mtalantikite wrote: post #37

The paper mentions voluntary activation of the sympathetic nervous system and anecdotally from my own meditation and yoga practice I've found that I have some control over a very specific SNS response. I'm able to control piloerection ("goose bump" activation) any time I want, something I wasn't ever able to do before and found to be quite strange when I noticed myself gaining control over it. Not exactly an awesome…

I figured out how to do this and how to get chills on demand on my last acid trip. I've forgotten how to do the goose bumps thing but I just tried the chills (you know the pleasurable sensation from good music) and that has remained.

Feels odd but LSD is a good tool for this stuff.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#43

Post by alfonsodev »

mtalantikite wrote: post #37

The paper mentions voluntary activation of the sympathetic nervous system and anecdotally from my own meditation and yoga practice I've found that I have some control over a very specific SNS response. I'm able to control piloerection ("goose bump" activation) any time I want, something I wasn't ever able to do before and found to be quite strange when I noticed myself gaining control over it. Not exactly an awesome…

Very interesting.

How quickly can you trigger it?

I've experienced something similar but it takes long time to arrive, at least 5-10 minutes, I wonder if with practice you found exactly the state that triggers it and you can do it instantly.

Also, have you felt it as in waves going up and down? or just located in same place ?

And lastly, does it have any health utility?

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#44

Post by Enginerrrd »

mtalantikite wrote: post #37

The paper mentions voluntary activation of the sympathetic nervous system and anecdotally from my own meditation and yoga practice I've found that I have some control over a very specific SNS response. I'm able to control piloerection ("goose bump" activation) any time I want, something I wasn't ever able to do before and found to be quite strange when I noticed myself gaining control over it. Not exactly an awesome…

I also gained this ability after meditating for an hour every day for ~4 months. A BUNCH of weird things started happening actually and I kind of backed off of it because of them. It proved to be a lot more than I really signed up for. (Fascinating things happened though...)

...But I have retained the piloerection ability, which I can do on command within 2-5 seconds or so. There's also some weird sensations in my sinuses I can trigger... it feels like the tissues contracting or something, not sure what it actually is, but that's what it feels like. ...And I regularly cry now at sad things, like movies and stories and the like. I used to never cry. Not like I was holding it in, but like, it just didn't happen.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#45

Post by drieddust »

itissid wrote: post #38

From a sample size PoV, 12 does not even matter, because they are looking for specific phyisiological responses and correlations. Its also good that they don't have a causal hypothesis statement: > These results could have important implications for the treatment of conditions associated with excessive or persistent inflammation, such as autoimmune diseases. Because there are a lot of confounds in making causal infer…

Thanks for asking this question. However, sample size is pretty large. There is a whole community of Sadhus and monks practising this for centuries. This is simply a part of Yoga.

Sample size seems small because Wim wants to hide his sources. See my other comment[1].

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24801967

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#46

Post by michaelcampbell »

misiti3780 wrote: post #17

I just finished the book "Breath" by James Nestor. The book was very interesting and talked a lot about some of this but I was wondering if anyone has done any research on the book,I walked away feeling like there was a possibility that a lot of it was bullshit

I read it and am not 100% convinced, although I am a dubious believer in some of the science promoted by Wim.

Nestor lost me when he started into the acidic diet, which has (IIRC) been resoundingly refuted.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#47

Post by steve_adams_86 »

jasonshen wrote: post #2

Wim Hof "Iceman" definitely gives me "cult leader" vibes but cool to see this research get published in a very reputable scientific journal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VaMjhwFE1Zw

I think the cult vibe might come from internet sensationalism. He seems fine. He says some weird unscientific stuff, but overall I think he believes in what he’s doing with a good nature about it, and I don’t see how harm can come from what he encourages. He has a very positive message.

One thing that compelled me to look into it was how little he seems to want money for his efforts. I mean, he makes money off of his name, but the iOS app for example is well made, helpful, and costs something like $2 CAD for advanced features. Admittedly the features are not exceptionally advanced, but I was expecting a higher price tag. It seemed like a reasonable ‘cover dev costs’ fee.

He’s on some podcasts of course, and you can get a decent sense for what he’s like. My creep meter doesn’t go off much with him, personally.

For what it’s worth, I’ve been using (and enjoying) wim hof techniques for a while and my assessment is definitely biased.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#48

Post by alexmorenodev »

udfalkso wrote: post #22
darth1 wrote: post #13

There is a great discussion of this paper on Rhonda Patrick’s podcast: https://www.foundmyfitness.com/episodes/pierre-capel She also has a episode where she interviews wim himself.

If you're short on time you may find these notes useful: https://podcastnotes.org/found-my-fitness/found-my-fitness-p... https://podcastnotes.org/found-my-fitness/found-my-fitness-p... Also this episode of James Nestor discussing breathing on the Joe Rogan Podcast may be of interest: https://podcastnotes.org/joe-rogan-experience/joe-rogan-expe... (Disclosure, I work on Podcast Notes)

Thanks for your work. I really enjoy it.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#49

Post by Igelau »

drieddust wrote: post #26

Wim hof have achieved great things practising the ancient practice of pranayama which is actually a part of yoga. Yet he presents it as if he "discovered" it. This is pure intellectual dishonesty. Yoga's actual name is ashtanga yoga which means it has eight limbs[1]. Contrary to popular belief Yoga is not about just twisting your body into weird poses. That aspect is called ASANA and what Wim Hof claims as his discov…

It's completely possible he rediscovered it independently, and free from the religious trappings.

> Yet he presents it as if he "discovered" it. This is pure intellectual dishonesty.

You might want to contemplate your accusatory nature on this topic as part of your practice.

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